ESPN: Your comprehensive guide to the 2021 college basketball coaching hot seat

[puc86]

3 minutes ago, chapelbull said:

 If the house was a dilapidated mess, then the first step would probably be to gut it so building back to the same number of bedrooms would be considered "improvement"

True but ultimately in real estate at the end of the day you are what your square footage and location says that you are, just as we really are simply what are wins and conference says that we are.

[puc86]

2 minutes ago, Triple B said:

Which is what you said in the first two sentences. What followed was mumbo jumbo ....

But if I didn’t add that little extra I wouldn’t have gotten to have this nice conversation with you and @chapelbull

[CousinRicky]

9 hours ago, puc86 said:

Sorry but most people in any other situation in life would not consider someone getting back to where they started as improvement.

When you look at charts/graphs with lines with one headed down and one is headed up. But at some point those lines intersect. I'd want the one headed up. So when we get back to the same as Charlie we'll be headed in the right direction. Charlie was the red line and I'm hoping CJS is the blue line.

[chapelbull]

4 minutes ago, puc86 said:

True but ultimately in real estate at the end of the day you are what your square footage and location says that you are, just as we really are simply what are wins and conference says that we are.

Eh, not exactly.  A dilapidated 2000 SF house in the exact same location as a shiny, new and/or improved 2000 SF house is not worth the same.   You are what someone is willing to pay for you

Just now, CousinRicky said:

When you look at charts/graphs with lines with one headed down and one is headed up. But at some point those lines intersect. I'd want the one headed up. So when we get back to the same as Charlie we'll be headed in the right direction. Charlie was the red line and I'm hoping CJS is the blue line.

Did you just make that up?   It is brilliant

[Triple B]

9 hours ago, puc86 said:

Smart the correct answer I would have went with is that CWT only won 10 but that would also be flawed (and I would hope no one would notice) because CCS would have followed our greatest coach in program history who finished his career with a perfect record.

Beautiful. Since my original hypothesis was "We've had 3 other coaches after Leavitt and the only one that had a worse year than his predecessor turned out to be the most successful" eliminates the TJ factor and we are back in business, baby!

[CousinRicky]

23 minutes ago, chapelbull said:

Eh, not exactly.  A dilapidated 2000 SF house in the exact same location as a shiny, new and/or improved 2000 SF house is not worth the same.   You are what someone is willing to pay for you

Did you just make that up?   It is brilliant

The chart? No. The idea that trajectories can be different? It did dawn on me just then. Had a good night's sleep for a change. Maybe that helped.  First time in a year or more than I got 7.5 hours straight.  But, as puc will point out, the part past the intersecting point is yet to be determined and actually hasn't been reached.  But he was arguing that getting back to the same point isn't a good thing when it actually is when trending.

[puc86]

4 minutes ago, CousinRicky said:

The chart? No. The idea that trajectories can be different? It did dawn on me just then. Had a good night's sleep for a change. Maybe that helped.  First time in a year or more than I got 7.5 hours straight.  But, as puc will point out, the part past the intersecting point is yet to be determined and actually hasn't been reached.  But he was arguing that getting back to the same point isn't a good thing when it actually is when trending.

Except both of those lines are straight trajectories and show a starting point and endpoint going in opposite directions if that’s what was going on no one would debate an improvement if it went from 1 to 4 but that’s not what’s happening CJS has a starting point of 4 and went to 1 which on a graph wouldn’t look like improvement so much as returning back to the baseline 

[BrassBulls12]

17 hours ago, puc86 said:

UTSA is the most comparable situation and they improved by as many games as we regressed which is why they got an A and we got a D as one of the worst hires that off season 

Grading College Football's First-Year Coaching Hires for 2020

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The 2020 college football season featured 24 new coaches at FBS programs, and with the year completed, its time to grade and rank the hires. UTSAs......

 As for teams impacted by having players missing, not being able to practice and games called off I compiled this small list of those from the FBS level but I am not sure if it is comprehensive. 

 

Team	Nickname	City	State[1]	Enrollment	Current Conference	Former Conferences	First Played	Joined FBS
Air Force	Falcons	Colorado Springs	Colorado	4,237	Mountain West	WAC	1955
Akron	Zips	Akron	Ohio	19,200	MAC	OAC, MCC, OVC	1891	1987
Alabama	Crimson Tide	Tuscaloosa	Alabama	38,500	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1892
Appalachian State	Mountaineers	Boone	North Carolina	19,100	Sun Belt	NSC, SoCon	1928	2014[n 1]
Arizona	Wildcats	Tucson	Arizona	45,200	Pac-12	BIAA, WAC	1899
Arizona State	Sun Devils	Tempe	Arizona	51,800	Pac-12	BIAA, WAC	1896
Arkansas	Razorbacks	Fayetteville	Arkansas	27,800	SEC	SWC	1894
Arkansas State	Red Wolves	Jonesboro	Arkansas	22,000	Sun Belt	Arkansas Intercollegiate Conference, Southland, Big West	1911	1992
Army	Black Knights	West Point	New York	4,300	Independent	C-USA	1890
Auburn	Tigers	Auburn	Alabama	30,400	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1892
Ball State	Cardinals	Muncie	Indiana	22,500	MAC	IIC, ICC	1924
Baylor	Bears	Waco	Texas	17,200	Big 12	TIAA, SWC	1899
Boise State	Broncos	Boise	Idaho	25,500	Mountain West	ICAC, Big Sky, Big West, WAC	1933[n 2]	1996
Boston College	Eagles	Chestnut Hill	Massachusetts	14,700	ACC	Big East	1893
Bowling Green	Falcons	Bowling Green	Ohio	23,000	MAC	Northwest Ohio Intercollegiate Athletic Association, OAC	1919
Buffalo	Bulls	Buffalo	New York	31,500	MAC	New York State Conference	1894	1999
BYU	Cougars	Provo	Utah	33,600	Independent	Rocky Mountain, Mountain States, WAC, MW	1922
California	Golden Bears	Berkeley	California	42,500	Pac-12	PCC	1882
Central Michigan	Chippewas	Mount Pleasant	Michigan	21,700	MAC	MCC, IIAC	1896
Charlotte	49ers	Charlotte	North Carolina	29,700	C-USA	Sun Belt, C-USA, A-10	2013	2015
Cincinnati	Bearcats	Cincinnati	Ohio	46,000	American	OAC, Buckeye Intercollegiate Athletic Association, MAC, MVC, C-USA, Big East	1885
Clemson	Tigers	Clemson	South Carolina	25,000	ACC	SIAA, SAIAA, SoCon	1896
Coastal Carolina	Chanticleers	Conway	South Carolina	10,600	Sun Belt	Big South	2003	2017
Colorado	Buffaloes	Boulder	Colorado	33,200	Pac-12	Colorado Football Association, Rocky Mountain, Mountain States, Big Eight, Big 12	1890
Colorado State	Rams	Fort Collins	Colorado	33,800	Mountain West	Colorado Football Association, Rocky Mountain, Mountain States, WAC	1890
Duke	Blue Devils	Durham	North Carolina	15,900	ACC	SoCon	1888
East Carolina	Pirates	Greenville	North Carolina	29,100	American	NSC, Carolinas, SoCon, C-USA	1932
Eastern Michigan	Eagles	Ypsilanti	Michigan	20,300	MAC	MIAA, MCC, IIAC, PAC	1891
FIU	Panthers	Miami	Florida	56,800	C-USA	Sun Belt	2002	2006
Florida	Gators	Gainesville	Florida	56,100	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1906
Florida Atlantic	Owls	Boca Raton	Florida	30,800	C-USA	Sun Belt	2001	2006
Florida State	Seminoles	Tallahassee	Florida	41,900	ACC	Dixie	1947
Fresno State	Bulldogs	Fresno	California	25,000	Mountain West	California Coast Conference, NCAC, CCAA, Big West, WAC	1921
Georgia	Bulldogs	Athens	Georgia	38,200	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1892
Georgia Southern	Eagles	Statesboro	Georgia	26,400	Sun Belt	SoCon	1924	2014
Georgia State	Panthers	Atlanta	Georgia	52,800	Sun Belt	CAA	2010	2013
Georgia Tech	Yellow Jackets	Atlanta	Georgia	32,700	ACC	SIAA, SoCon, SEC	1892
Hawaii	Rainbow Warriors	Honolulu	Hawai'i	17,700	Mountain West	WAC	1909
Houston	Cougars	Houston	Texas	42,700	American	Lone Star, Gulf Coast, MVC, SWC, C-USA[n 3]	1946
Illinois	Fighting Illini	Urbana–Champaign	Illinois	51,200	Big Ten	Illinois Intercollegiate Football League	1890
Indiana	Hoosiers	Bloomington	Indiana	43,700	Big Ten	IIAA	1887
Iowa	Hawkeyes	Iowa City	Iowa	33,000	Big Ten	WIUFA, MVC	1889
Iowa State	Cyclones	Ames	Iowa	33,400	Big 12	MVC, Big 8	1892
Kansas	Jayhawks	Lawrence	Kansas	27,700	Big 12	KCAC, WIUFA, MVC, Big 8	1890
Kansas State	Wildcats	Manhattan	Kansas	21,700	Big 12	MVC, Big 8	1896
Kent State	Golden Flashes	Kent	Ohio	39,300	MAC	OAC	1920
Kentucky	Wildcats	Lexington	Kentucky	29,200	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1881
Liberty	Flames	Lynchburg	Virginia	15,000	Independent	Big South	1973	2018
Louisiana	Ragin' Cajuns	Lafayette	Louisiana	19,200	Sun Belt	Louisiana Intercollegiate Athletic Association, Louisiana Intercollegiate Conference, Gulf States Conference, SIAA, Southland, Big West	1902
Louisiana–Monroe	Warhawks	Monroe	Louisiana	8,800	Sun Belt	Gulf States Conference, Southland, Independent	1951	1994
Louisiana Tech	Bulldogs	Ruston	Louisiana	12,400	C-USA	Louisiana Intercollegiate Athletic Association, Louisiana Intercollegiate Conference, Gulf States Conference, SIAA, Southland, Big West, WAC	1901	1989
Louisville	Cardinals	Louisville	Kentucky	22,600	ACC	KIAC, SIAA, KIAC, OVC, MVC, C-USA, Big East, American	1910
LSU	Tigers	Baton Rouge	Louisiana	30,800	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1893
Marshall	Thundering Herd	Huntington	West Virginia	13,200	C-USA	WVIAC, Buckeye Conference, OVC, MAC, SoCon	1895	1997[n 1]
Maryland	Terrapins	College Park	Maryland	41,200	Big Ten	MIFA, SAIAA, SoCon, ACC	1888
Memphis	Tigers	Memphis	Tennessee	21,500	American	Mississippi Valley Conference, SIAA, MVC, C-USA[n 3]	1912
Miami (FL)	Hurricanes	Coral Gables[n 4]	Florida	17,300	ACC	SIAA, Big East	1926[2]
Miami (OH)	RedHawks	Oxford	Ohio	24,300	MAC	OAC, Buckeye Conference	1888
Michigan	Wolverines	Ann Arbor	Michigan	46,000	Big Ten		1879
Michigan State	Spartans	East Lansing	Michigan	50,300	Big Ten	MIAA	1885
Middle Tennessee	Blue Raiders	Murfreesboro	Tennessee	21,900	C-USA	VSAC, SIAA, OVC, Sun Belt	1911	1999
Minnesota	Golden Gophers	Minneapolis	Minnesota	47,800	Big Ten		1882
Mississippi State	Bulldogs	Starkville	Mississippi	22,200	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1895
Missouri	Tigers	Columbia	Missouri	30,000	SEC	WIUFA, Big 8, Big 12	1890
Navy	Midshipmen	Annapolis	Maryland	4,600	American	Independent	1879
NC State	Wolfpack	Raleigh	North Carolina	35,500	ACC	SAIAA, SIAA, SoCon	1892
Nebraska	Cornhuskers	Lincoln	Nebraska	25,800	Big Ten	WIUFA, MVC, Big 8, Big 12	1890
Nevada	Wolf Pack	Reno	Nevada	21,600	Mountain West	NCAC, Big Sky, Big West, WAC	1896	1992
New Mexico	Lobos	Albuquerque	New Mexico	26,300	Mountain West	BIAA, WAC	1892
New Mexico State	Aggies	Las Cruces	New Mexico	21,900	Independent	BIAA, MVC, Big West, Sun Belt, WAC	1893
North Carolina	Tar Heels	Chapel Hill	North Carolina	29,800	ACC	SAIAA, SIAA, SoCon	1888
North Texas	Mean Green	Denton	Texas	39,400	C-USA	TIAA, Lone Star, Gulf Coast Conference, MVC, Southland, Big West, Sun Belt	1913	1995
Northern Illinois	Huskies	DeKalb	Illinois	20,000	MAC	IIAC, Big West	1899
Northwestern	Wildcats	Evanston	Illinois	21,200	Big Ten		1876
Notre Dame	Fighting Irish	South Bend	Indiana	12,300	Independent		1887
Ohio	Bobcats	Athens	Ohio	34,900	MAC	OAC, Buckeye Conference	1894
Ohio State	Buckeyes	Columbus	Ohio	68,100	Big Ten	OAC	1889
Oklahoma	Sooners	Norman	Oklahoma	28,500	Big 12	Oklahoma Intercollegiate Conference, SWC, MVC, Big 8	1895
Oklahoma State	Cowboys	Stillwater	Oklahoma	25,300	Big 12	Oklahoma Intercollegiate Conference, SWC, MVC, Big 8	1901
Old Dominion	Monarchs	Norfolk	Virginia	25,000	C-USA	CAA	2009	2014
Ole Miss	Rebels	Oxford	Mississippi	23,200	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1890
Oregon	Ducks	Eugene	Oregon	22,700	Pac-12	PCC, Independent	1894
Oregon State	Beavers	Corvallis	Oregon	30,900	Pac-12	PCC, Independent	1893
Penn State	Nittany Lions	University Park	Pennsylvania	46,600	Big Ten		1881
Pittsburgh	Panthers	Pittsburgh	Pennsylvania	28,600	ACC	Big East	1890
Purdue	Boilermakers	West Lafayette	Indiana	43,400	Big Ten	IIAA	1887
Rice	Owls	Houston	Texas	7,100	C-USA	TIAA, SWC, WAC	1912
Rutgers	Scarlet Knights	Piscataway	New Jersey	70,900	Big Ten	Middle Atlantic, Big East, American	1869
San Diego State	Aztecs	San Diego	California	34,900	Mountain West	Southern California Junior College Conference, SCIAC, CCAA, Big West, WAC	1921	1969
San Jose State	Spartans	San Jose	California	32,800	Mountain West	California Coast Conference, NCAC, California Collegiate, Big West, WAC	1892
SMU	Mustangs	University Park	Texas	11,800	American	TIAA, SWC, WAC, C-USA[n 3]	1915
South Alabama	Jaguars	Mobile	Alabama	15,100	Sun Belt		2009	2012
South Carolina	Gamecocks	Columbia	South Carolina	50,100	SEC	SIAA, SoCon, ACC	1892
South Florida	Bulls	Tampa	Florida	50,700	American	C-USA, Big East	1997	2001
Southern Miss	Golden Eagles	Hattiesburg	Mississippi	14,500	C-USA	Gulf States Conference, SIAA	1912
Stanford	Cardinal	Stanford	California	16,500	Pac-12	PCC	1891
Syracuse	Orange	Syracuse	New York	22,900	ACC	Big East	1889
TCU	Horned Frogs	Fort Worth	Texas	10,400	Big 12	TIAA, SWC, WAC, C-USA, MW	1896
Temple	Owls	Philadelphia	Pennsylvania	40,000	American	Middle Atlantic, Big East, MAC, Big East	1894
Tennessee	Volunteers	Knoxville	Tennessee	28,900	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1891
Texas	Longhorns	Austin	Texas	51,800	Big 12	SIAA, TIAA, SWC	1893
Texas A&M	Aggies	College Station	Texas	69,400	SEC	SIAA, SWC, Big 12	1894
Texas State	Bobcats	San Marcos	Texas	38,800	Sun Belt	TIAA, Lone Star, Gulf Star, Southland, WAC	1904	2012
Texas Tech	Red Raiders	Lubbock	Texas	38,200	Big 12	BIAA, SWC	1925
Toledo	Rockets	Toledo	Ohio	23,100	MAC	Northwestern Ohio Intercollegiate Athletic Association, OAC	1917
Troy	Trojans	Troy	Alabama	18,100	Sun Belt	Alabama Intercollegiate Conference, SIAA, Alabama Collegiate Conference, Mid-South Athletic Conference, Gulf South, Southland	1909	2002
Tulane	Green Wave	New Orleans	Louisiana	14,100	American	SIAA, SoCon, SEC, C-USA	1893
Tulsa	Golden Hurricane	Tulsa	Oklahoma	3,297[3]	American	Oklahoma Intercollegiate Conference, Big 4 Conference, MVC, WAC, C-USA	1895
UAB	Blazers	Birmingham	Alabama	21,900	C-USA		1991	1999
UCF	Knights	Orlando	Florida	68,600	American	MAC, C-USA	1979	1996
UCLA	Bruins	Los Angeles	California	45,400	Pac-12	SCIAC, PCC	1919
UConn	Huskies	Storrs[n 5]	Connecticut	32,200	Independent	Yankee, A-10, Big East, American	1896	2000
UMass	Minutemen	Amherst	Massachusetts	30,600	Independent	Yankee, A-10, CAA, MAC	1879	2012
UNLV	Rebels	Las Vegas[n 6]	Nevada	30,500	Mountain West	Big West, WAC	1968	1978
USC	Trojans	Los Angeles	California	45,700	Pac-12	PCC	1888
UTEP	Miners	El Paso	Texas	25,100	C-USA	BIAA, WAC	1914
UTSA	Roadrunners	San Antonio	Texas	30,700	C-USA	WAC	2011	2012
Utah	Utes	Salt Lake City	Utah	33,000	Pac-12	Colorado Football Association, RMAC, Mountain States, WAC, MW	1892
Utah State	Aggies	Logan	Utah	29,400	Mountain West	Colorado Football Association, RMAC, Mountain States, Big West, Independent, Sun Belt, WAC	1892
Vanderbilt	Commodores	Nashville	Tennessee	13,100	SEC	SIAA, SoCon	1890
Virginia	Cavaliers	Charlottesville	Virginia	24,400	ACC	SAIAA, SoCon	1888
Virginia Tech	Hokies	Blacksburg	Virginia	33,400	ACC	SAIAA, SIAA, SoCon, Big East	1892
Wake Forest	Demon Deacons	Winston-Salem	North Carolina	8,100	ACC	Big Five Conference, SoCon	1888
Washington	Huskies	Seattle	Washington	47,900	Pac-12	PCC	1889
Washington State	Cougars	Pullman	Washington	30,600	Pac-12	PCC, Independent	1893
West Virginia	Mountaineers	Morgantown	West Virginia	30,000	Big 12	SoCon, WVIAC, Big East	1891
Western Kentucky	Hilltoppers	Bowling Green	Kentucky	20,300	C-USA	SIAA, KIAC, OVC, MVFC, Sun Belt	1913	2009
Western Michigan	Broncos	Kalamazoo	Michigan	22,900	MAC	MCC	1905
Wisconsin	Badgers	Madison	Wisconsin	44,400	Big Ten		1889
Wyoming	Cowboys	Laramie	Wyoming	12,400	Mountain West	Colorado Football Association, RMAC, WAC	1893

Cool list, does not illustrate the point  as I said it affected everyone differently. You can't tell me having 7 of your 11 defensive starters unavailable is the same as having a few practice squad players out. Not really talking specifics but that's the spectrum. You also can't tell me that having 98th toughest schedule doesn't account for a few wins either. 

In any case its covid effected everyone differently, due to differing case numbers, due to differing state protocols, due to differing university protocols. It was just different. 

 

This is also a line form your article 

"Scott was a good hire for USF, but it’s going to take time to rebuild in Tampa."

[CousinRicky]

16 minutes ago, puc86 said:

Except both of those lines are straight trajectories and show a starting point and endpoint going in opposite directions if that’s what was going on no one would debate an improvement if it went from 1 to 4 but that’s not what’s happening CJS has a starting point of 4 and went to 1 which on a graph wouldn’t look like improvement so much as returning back to the baseline 

But then the line would be headed in the right direction. Let's label that line 'O' for Optimism.

[Guest Jonesy Bull]

11 hours ago, puc86 said:

I am unfortunately living in the present which is why I am not happy with our current situation where we just finished the worst season in team history and are heading into one that looks far more difficult than the season we just screwed the pooch on. To make matters worse we are already making excuses for what will be the third year and we can only bring in like 10 recruits next season. So the future I’m looking towards isn’t looking too bright either. If we are .500 in year three that’s not success and that’s not a good enough reason to have lost the vast majority of our games for two years. I hope to G-d that things are better than those pulling for CJS the hardest claim but if we win one game then at best 4 games to have it all pay off at year 3 going .500 everyone needs to be fired.

I don't think anybody would be very happy with only .500 after Year 3.  I would be disappointed in that scenario as well.  That's why I'm questioning the CBG and Basketball situation.  We should be better than this by now.

By Year 3 in Football I'm looking for us to be a winning team with a continued upward trajectory.  I just think you are being a little impatient with CJS after just one Covid / Evaluation year, where he admitted before the season started that the wins vs losses were probably not going to be very good.  That tells me he at least has an eye on what type of talent and team we had at the time.  He seems to be trying to do something about that......This season does need to show quite a bit of improvement, I agree.  That in my mind means 4-5 wins.