UCF Over Memphis...Better for Us?

[puc86]

1 minute ago, Bull Dozer said:

Awww cute a political diss. Some people want to smash people at their best others hope somebody else does it for them. 

I make me laugh. The moral of the story is the odds of finishing a season undefeated is somewhere at or below 1/129, so having teams be undefeated until their last game and then praying we are in a position where beating them to matter to getting us to the next level aren’t exactly strong. If we have them win all their games and lose to us in the final game but we tie our best season ever that means they go to the conference championship and the NY6 bowl game and we get to go to Ray Jay for our bowl game. Thinking that’s somehow good or worth it just so we can say we beat them while they were undefeated seems kind of like cutting off our nose to spite our face, but I guess if it means more bravado it’s probably worth i.

[Triple B]

1 hour ago, JTrue said:

That's where I'm coming from. I want us to win and to beat the best teams we can play. UCF being undefeated helps us THIS year if we win and it makes that game better if we both go in 11-0. Hell, I want Milton to be the Heisman front runner when we play them. Some of you want him to be hurt for the game. Jesus, grow a pair and want to beat every team's best. Quit dreaming about whether anything we do right now is going to mean we get a P5 invite in 40 years.

**** that ****. I want a conference championship and nothing would please me more than having the division clinched before Black Friday ...... and what help does UCF provide THIS year if we win?

[puc86]

21 minutes ago, Triple B said:

**** that ****. I want a conference championship and nothing would please me more than having the division clinched before Black Friday ...... and what help does UCF provide THIS year if we win?

Pretty much every team and fanbase aims to wrap up their place in a championship as soon as possible, this is the first place I’ve ever seen where people thought prolonging the drama was somehow more beneficial to their team. We are an odd bunch. If we win against UCF the only thing directly tied to that victory is the stupid bore on I-4 trophy which doesn’t get any bigger for them being undefeated or defeated when we play them. As I keep pointing out to the blind, with little acknowledgement , is that going undefeated in college football happens to a program about as often as Halley’s comet so hoping UCF remains undefeated up until we play them almost assures that when we do play them the only thing we would be playing for is to hope to maybe ruin their season with them having two solid years of being on top, no thanks that’s dumb with absolutely no upside and a potential to differentiate our programs but in an unfortunate and bad way (and i didn’t even know that’s possible).

[chapelbull]

2 hours ago, brybull1970 said:

You may be too young to remember this but back in 2006, when USF was in the Big East, the conference had three teams with a combined record of 25-2, and all were ranked in the Top 10 as late as mid-November. Having three schools ascend up the rankings through the season created a lot of positive attention for the league for which all members of the league benefited. It proved that Big East football belonged - not that it was the best, but it belonged.

Now while the conference wasn’t able to stave off expansion due to a series of events (I’m looking at you ESPN), all three of those teams ironically are now in the P5. So to coin a phrase, a rising tide lifts all boats and without all three enjoying success on the football field the conference, and other schools in it, would not have benefited from that incredible run.

So if all you want is to be the tallest midget and win a division title then absolutely root for UCF to lose every game - root for everyone to lose. I might even suggest you push to have USF to step down to FCS football so you can populate that trophy case in your mind. But for those USF fans who remember 2006 and 2008, we have our sights set on a higher prize, which we know can happen quicker if the conference has success. 

We want the short term success you crave,  but realize USF has more long term viability when that success is achieved against better competition. 

So we'll root for Memphis and Houston ... **** central

[JTrue]

10 hours ago, Triple B said:

**** that ****. I want a conference championship and nothing would please me more than having the division clinched before Black Friday ...... and what help does UCF provide THIS year if we win?

I assume our goals are to 1) Win the Conference and 2) finish the season with as high a ranking/most publicity possible.

So the question is, would UCF beating Memphis be better for us in achieving those goals. Absolutely.

Since these are the two things everyone is debating, an undefeated UCF vs. a 6-5 UCF on Black Friday:

Scenario a) UCF wins out until we play them. We win. Helps goal #1 and goal #2.

Scenario b) UCF loses out until we play them. We win. Helps #1 since it's a conference victory. Does nothing for goal #2.

Scenario c) UCF wins out and beats us. Certainly doesn't help goal #1. But doesn't hurt goal #2 as much.

Scenario d) UCF loses out and beats us. Goal #1 and goal #2 go down in flames. CCS becomes xCCS. TBP completely melts down. Judy leaves and we're stuck with the Meryl Lynch logo. smazza begins using punctuation. Puc posts something positive about USF. The Yankees sign Machado and Harper. 

Edited October 19, 2018 by JTrue

[Grateful Dad]

3 hours ago, brybull1970 said:

You may be too young to remember this but back in 2006, when USF was in the Big East, the conference had three teams with a combined record of 25-2, and all were ranked in the Top 10 as late as mid-November. Having three schools ascend up the rankings through the season created a lot of positive attention for the league for which all members of the league benefited. It proved that Big East football belonged - not that it was the best, but it belonged.

Now while the conference wasn’t able to stave off expansion due to a series of events (I’m looking at you ESPN), all three of those teams ironically are now in the P5. So to coin a phrase, a rising tide lifts all boats and without all three enjoying success on the football field the conference, and other schools in it, would not have benefited from that incredible run.

So if all you want is to be the tallest midget and win a division title then absolutely root for UCF to lose every game - root for everyone to lose. I might even suggest you push to have USF to step down to FCS football so you can populate that trophy case in your mind. But for those USF fans who remember 2006 and 2008, we have our sights set on a higher prize, which we know can happen quicker if the conference has success. 

We want the short term success you crave,  but realize USF has more long term viability when that success is achieved against better competition. 

Bry, back then the BE was considered the lowest of the major conferences (moniker - Big Least), but was grudgingly afforded some respect due to the three teams doing so well.  The teams selected were also good in MBB, IIRC.  So, we were in the "club" and accepting our progress wasn't letting an outsider in.  We are no longer "in the club" and breaking into the P5 will not be earned but gifted in the minds of P5.  A conference championship should rightly be our next goal.  But, as I have said before, our key to advancement is more likely beating quality P5 teams.  A conference championship of a disrespected conference is just a disrespected championship.  Beating WVA, FSU, ND, Miami, etc. did more for us than a BE title would have done.  Teams saw that and are loath to schedule us now.  I want us to earn a spot at the grownup's table.  Not count on another team's success to "lift our boat".

[puc86]

4 hours ago, brybull1970 said:

You may be too young to remember this but back in 2006, when USF was in the Big East, the conference had three teams with a combined record of 25-2, and all were ranked in the Top 10 as late as mid-November. Having three schools ascend up the rankings through the season created a lot of positive attention for the league for which all members of the league benefited. It proved that Big East football belonged - not that it was the best, but it belonged.

Now while the conference wasn’t able to stave off expansion due to a series of events (I’m looking at you ESPN), all three of those teams ironically are now in the P5. So to coin a phrase, a rising tide lifts all boats and without all three enjoying success on the football field the conference, and other schools in it, would not have benefited from that incredible run.

So if all you want is to be the tallest midget and win a division title then absolutely root for UCF to lose every game - root for everyone to lose. I might even suggest you push to have USF to step down to FCS football so you can populate that trophy case in your mind. But for those USF fans who remember 2006 and 2008, we have our sights set on a higher prize, which we know can happen quicker if the conference has success. 

We want the short term success you crave,  but realize USF has more long term viability when that success is achieved against better competition. 

I remember it vividly and that story ended badly for us and gave us no future benefit in any way shape or form. If anything it’s a cautionary tale about how cheering for other teams to buoy your boat with their success is shortsighted and stupid and will only lead to longterm disaster for your program as you get left high and dry and ESPN rips your conference apart  from limb to limb. The BEAST was nothing like the AAC it had traditional teams still in it and was begrudgingly to the rest of the world remaining a power conference that all of media and fandom mocked at every turn as they desperately waited for it to be destroyed and to lose power as teams continued to be picked off. This is in no way to be confused with our current situation where we have a conference that has never had any power, teams that are not traditional power rich schools and a cabal of conferences that have specifically banded together with the expressed purpose of keeping themselves in power and separated from the G5. There is honestly no long term, short term, medium term or any term benefit to USF by having UCF win anything at anytime and it is painfully obvious. CJL was right to have wanted to leave them in our rearview mirror at 0-4 as bringing them back into our lives has done absolutely nothing good to our program and everything good to theirs. 

[chapelbull]

I don't think beating an undefeated ucf over a ucf with losses helps us enough for me to root for them weekly.  

[puc86]

4 minutes ago, chapelbull said:

I don't think beating an undefeated ucf over a ucf with losses helps us enough for me to root for them weekly.  

It gains us nothing, there is no such thing as a quality G5 victory in the world in which we live.

[Grateful Dad]

1 minute ago, puc86 said:

It gains us nothing, there is no such thing as a quality G5 victory in the world in which we live.

puc, help me understand this.  Do you mean that no matter how good the G5 team is that we beat, it will be discounted as a fluke, the G5 team was at a historic low, or some such?