Will USF fans have the patience with Skip . . .

[SANJAY]

Brian Kelly won 2 conference titles and had 3 10 win seasons in 3 years at UC.

Alright so let's hang in there for a few years.  Maybe one Big East game is too early to pull out the rug.

Brian Kelly in his first season took a 7 win team down to 4 wins as he retooled.  Skip will build the team up but this is a transition year. We won't see what the coaching staff can really do until next year. Meanwhile the Defense is even better this year than last year.  

Brian Kelly had 3 seasons at UC and went:

10-3 (4-3)

11-3 (6-1)

12-0 (7-0)

Mark Dantonio went 7-5, 4-7 and 7-5 the three years before Kelly got there.

[Rocky Style]

Brian Kelly won 2 conference titles and had 3 10 win seasons in 3 years at UC.

Alright so let's hang in there for a few years.  Maybe one Big East game is too early to pull out the rug.

Brian Kelly in his first season took a 7 win team down to 4 wins as he retooled.  Skip will build the team up but this is a transition year. We won't see what the coaching staff can really do until next year. Meanwhile the Defense is even better this year than last year.  

Brian Kelly had 3 seasons at UC and went:

10-3 (4-3)

11-3 (6-1)

12-0 (7-0)

Mark Dantonio went 7-5, 4-7 and 7-5 the three years before Kelly got there.

And then at the first sniff of success he ditched his team like an ******* and left them to get embarrassed in a BCS bowl game. 

[SANJAY]

Brian Kelly won 2 conference titles and had 3 10 win seasons in 3 years at UC.

Alright so let's hang in there for a few years.  Maybe one Big East game is too early to pull out the rug.

Brian Kelly in his first season took a 7 win team down to 4 wins as he retooled.  Skip will build the team up but this is a transition year. We won't see what the coaching staff can really do until next year. Meanwhile the Defense is even better this year than last year.  

Brian Kelly had 3 seasons at UC and went:

10-3 (4-3)

11-3 (6-1)

12-0 (7-0)

Mark Dantonio went 7-5, 4-7 and 7-5 the three years before Kelly got there.

And then at the first sniff of success he ditched his team like an ******* and left them to get embarrassed in a BCS bowl game. 

Is your position that if we're successful then the coach may leave?  So sucking is ok?

[Rocky Style]

Brian Kelly won 2 conference titles and had 3 10 win seasons in 3 years at UC.

Alright so let's hang in there for a few years.  Maybe one Big East game is too early to pull out the rug.

Brian Kelly in his first season took a 7 win team down to 4 wins as he retooled.  Skip will build the team up but this is a transition year. We won't see what the coaching staff can really do until next year. Meanwhile the Defense is even better this year than last year.  

Brian Kelly had 3 seasons at UC and went:

10-3 (4-3)

11-3 (6-1)

12-0 (7-0)

Mark Dantonio went 7-5, 4-7 and 7-5 the three years before Kelly got there.

And then at the first sniff of success he ditched his team like an ******* and left them to get embarrassed in a BCS bowl game. 

That's not the point of the thread. You may want to go back and read it.

Sorry to all the BK fans but we didn't fire Leavitt early enough to get him.  Meanwhile, we have a coach.

[Ghostofbigworm]

I wonder what Alabama fans thought of nick Saban when he lost at home to Louisiana Monroe his first season.

Better yet, I wonder if the loss made Saban want to stray from his plans and start calling plays that the team used to run well under the old coach who had them playing like a mediocre SEC unit.

Everyone, even an unmitigated disaster like Kragthorpe got three years. . . . . . this type of talk after five games is ludicrous in my opinion.

No one is calling for Holtz to be fired already (that I have seen).  Obviously he is going to be here for a few years. 

I don't think the situation at Bama will be quite the same as ours.  Why don't you go back and check what Saban did in his second and third seasons at Bama.  Undefeated regular seasons and National Titles can make fans forget about a bad loss real quick.

[commbull]

Besides that our teams had been fairly successful--not as much as most would want, but going to bowl games and winning some good games each year--recruiting was improving every year. We would not have tolerated a drubbing like that from Cuse by CJL, and I don't see why it should be okay with the new guy. Great coaches don't just wait to recruit the guys they need for their systems, they coach the players they have, they design schemes and plays that the players they have can execute.  Maybe this will turn around--I sure hope so.

[Carolina_Bull]

Brian Kelly won 2 conference titles and had 3 10 win seasons in 3 years at UC.

Alright so let's hang in there for a few years.  Maybe one Big East game is too early to pull out the rug.

Brian Kelly in his first season took a 7 win team down to 4 wins as he retooled.  Skip will build the team up but this is a transition year. We won't see what the coaching staff can really do until next year. Meanwhile the Defense is even better this year than last year.  

Brian Kelly had 3 seasons at UC and went:

10-3 (4-3)

11-3 (6-1)

12-0 (7-0)

Mark Dantonio went 7-5, 4-7 and 7-5 the three years before Kelly got there.

It is intellectualy dishonest to compare the Dantonio/Kelly turnover to the Leavitt/Holtz turnover.

One scenario involves a coach succeding by all measurements and making a dignified December exit that allowed the team and the fan base to rally behid the replacement.  The other involved allegations of player abuse, a hasty, forced banishment 2.5 weeks before LOI day, a split locker room, a split fan base and an ongoing lawsuit.  And while Dantonio immediately moved on, Leavitt hangs around in the 813 leveling allegations (through counsel) to embarrass and weaken USF athletics. . . . . all the while, Holtz sets up the new way of doing things.

In some respects, Holtz's placement in the HC position is easier to analogize to Mohammed Karzai taking over for the Taliban than it is to analogize to Kelly taking over for Dantonio.

[Brad]

Also when Kelly took over I don't think D'Antonio had reached #2 in country and had several national rankings and headline grabbing upsets.  I could be wrong.  I think Kelly took over an modestly successful program at best and took it to new heights.  Holtz has taken over a successful program (by most measures) and will take a while to get back to #2 and the expectations that go with it.

We sat here for years, some fans, wondering why with all the talent on the roster Leavitt couldn't get into a BCS bowl.  Now we talk as if there is no talent here.  It's really quite funny to watch.

To bring on the Leavitt situation and court case is, in court terminology, irrelevant.

First, it wasn't what you describe.  Secondly, USF could have resolved it without pulling the plunger on the program.

It's intellectually dishonest to include the Leavitt shenanigans and the Miller allegations as being at all related to the product on the field.

Skip's a big boy with support from the school and the fans.  To imply the dirty part of a mishandled administrative issue is to blame for the chaos on the field is also intellectually dishonest.

It's just football.  Hopefully we figure that out.

[USF_Grouper]

Also when Kelly took over I don't think D'Antonio had reached #2 in country and had several national rankings and headline grabbing upsets.  I could be wrong.  I think Kelly took over an modestly successful program at best and took it to new heights.  Holtz has taken over a successful program (by most measures) and will take a while to get back to #2 and the expectations that go with it.

I think most around USF, including Jim Leavitt, would define success as "starting" at winning a conference championship.  We had a few upset wins, and even an uncanny sequence of events that lead us to a #2 ranking (I forget, what were we ranked at the end of that year?).  I think you could only define the program as successful if you took into account its relative youth.  Modestly successful, I'd bet, is as far as most are willing to go in describing USF under Jim Leavitt.

[Brad]

Also when Kelly took over I don't think D'Antonio had reached #2 in country and had several national rankings and headline grabbing upsets.  I could be wrong.  I think Kelly took over an modestly successful program at best and took it to new heights.  Holtz has taken over a successful program (by most measures) and will take a while to get back to #2 and the expectations that go with it.

I think most around USF, including Jim Leavitt, would define success as "starting" at winning a conference championship.

Stopping right there.  I think you'd be wrong.  Most know and agreed with Leavitt that beating UF, FSU and Miami and Top 25 programs meant more to the program than beating UConn, Pitt and Cincy to name a few of the BE teams.

Grouper, I think you're an intelligent guy, but you should think about what would truly mean more to a young program.  Winning in an often ridiculed and maligned conference that many thought would lose BCS certification or beating the Big 3 right here in the home state.  It's not that hard.  For you to think otherwise is not shocking, but telling.

Also when Kelly took over I don't think D'Antonio had reached #2 in country and had several national rankings and headline grabbing upsets.  I could be wrong.  I think Kelly took over an modestly successful program at best and took it to new heights.  Holtz has taken over a successful program (by most measures) and will take a while to get back to #2 and the expectations that go with it.

Modestly successful, I'd bet, is as far as most are willing to go in describing USF under Jim Leavitt.

You might want to read more.  USF has become the blueprint for many new programs.  Typically that doesn't happen when you are only moderately successful.

I know it helps some of you to dismiss the past but you really should learn to live with it instead.  It's more healthy.