Larkin has dropped us

[Bullpride08]

USF will win the Big East, in football, at least once, maybe multiple times, before we EVER spend 2-3 million on a hoops head coach.  The fact that we spent what we did on Heath was very surprising.

I'm not calling Heath a Godsend, just saying that we can't really do better under the current circumstances.  We can't.  If we had more money for hoops, sure!  but we don't... and won't, for a long time.  And football isn't going to be helping speed that along this year.

I don't disagree with your position above, but I am also not advocating spending $2-3M on a hoops HC right now either.  My point is we got what we paid for with Heath, a semi-decent recruiter who is a pretty good coach and teacher and program builder.  His weakness is recruiting, and the best idea is for USF to put $500k for the next several years into hoops, more importantly to hire a couple of assistants who can become recruiting studs that have all the contacts.  But it won't be cheap for USF to attract.  Woolard needs to contemplate because after spending all this money on facilities it would be a shame if no top notch recruits came by to see it.

If we're not going to do that then Heath may not be the coach for USF.  It is no small feat to recruit and coach here, but USF also shouldn't spend years 'figuring that out', but opt to soon move on to another maybe more recruiting orientated coach.

[Velcro]

You mention heath as a semi-decent recruiter... I don't see it that way.

He WAS a very good recruiter as an assistant at Mich St... Yes mich st has WAY more to offer than we do, plus Izzo as the head coach.

He was a good recruiter at Arkansas. His teams were loaded and did well in a decent league, just not up to par with Ark's desires.

He hasn't done well here, but that isn't necessarily b/c he is bad at it as much as the product he is selling stinks.  Having better assistants would certainly improve the product some, as far as play on court, but as far as our history and the fact we are a bottom feeder in the absolute toughest league ever assembled, I'm not sure how anyone without the name recognition of a 2 million$ coach can possibly sell a kid on coming here without having much chance at ever playing in an ncaa tournament.  That is what Stan is up against now.  It stinks, but I do feel Stan is a better recruiter than we are seeing only b/c he is selling been trying to sell a steaming turd.  Sure Coach K could sell a steaming turd, or Billy Donavan, or someone kids know very well, but Stan isn't in that boat, which is how we could afford him.

[Vega]

The Big East is very tough in basketball and two seasons ago the league was probably the most powerful conference ever seen. Well guess what? The league has gotten even stronger now because Rutgers, DePaul, St John's, and Seton Hall are no longer 1 or 2 wins to feed off of. All those schools have gotten new coaches that brought energy and excitement to their programs that had been left for dead. I honestly don't get the sense that USF fans quite understand the predicament that the Bulls are in going forward. That revelation is the thesis for everything that I have written recently. While some view my words as being bitter and anger, the truth is my words are that of a concerned Bulls basketball fan that wants his team to be a WINNER.

Recruiting is the lifelood of all collegiate sports. Just like the body has to have blood to survive, a college program has to have talent to survive. 1 bad recruiting class can set a program back 2 seasons. Velco that is what ultimately doomed Heath at Arkansas. Stan is not a great closer with recruits. He wasn't at Arkansas and he hasn't been here at USF. He has an eye for talent and can get them interested in a program which is what made him a great assistant to Tom Izzo. The list below is the most talented players Heath got at Arkansas and you will notice a theme:

Steven Hill - Was going to Kansas, but AAU coach(Arkansas wings) was like a father figure to Hill and brother to Steven's dad. He is the sole reason Hill signed with Arkansas. It was shocking

Charles Thomas - Asst coach Oronde Taliaferro

Darrian Townes - Asst coach Ronnie Thompson. Was going to Georgetown but ended up following Thompson to Ark.

Ronnie Brewer - Dad was a legend at Ark and wanted his kid to play 5 minutes from campus. Heath's best work ever as head coach. He got the Ark job and convinced Brewer to play at the UA

Olu Famutimi - shady AAU buddy that Heath had

Jonathon Modica - previous coaching staff. Much like Dominique Jones

Patrick Beverley - family in Arkansas and mom wanted to come home from Chicago. Similar to the Jerrid Famous recruitment

Sonny Weems - Coach Cox was promised future employment by Heath. Well he is here on USF's staff

Michael Washington - Again family in Arkansas and admittedly would have committed to any coach at Ark so he could come back home

Btw Taliaferro got Al Jefferson to Ark as well. He also should get some credit with getting Beverely too.

That clearly points out that Heath as HC needs at least 1 bulldog recruiter, a true go getter with connections.

[Paisa el Toro]

That clearly points out that Heath as HC needs at least 1 bulldog recruiter, a true go getter with connections.

Or, alternatively, it shows how **** tough it is to recruit here at USF. Greenberg was probably the most competent recruiter of all the coaches we had, and even he had a tough time putting a proper team together.

[Triple B]

That clearly points out that Heath as HC needs at least 1 bulldog recruiter, a true go getter with connections.

Or, alternatively, it shows how **** tough it is to recruit here at USF. Greenberg was probably the most competent recruiter of all the coaches we had, and even he had a tough time putting a proper team together.

Exactly .... Seth did a good job recruiting before and after USF ... Stan did a good job recruitin before USF. That just can't be ignored.

Ironic thing is the USF coach with the least amount of recruiting credentials has 2 of his guys in the NBA. .... Go figure.

[DELdaBull]

I'm not sold on our PG position with this team.  That is why Larkin was a must have.  NCAA Bball is a point guard league.  You can't win, nor go far without them.  The crucial position.  The fact that Stan was after Larkin so much tells me he doesn't have faith in the PGs on this team as well.  If so you could wait for next years PG crop. 

[Velcro]

I'm not sold on our PG position with this team.  That is why Larkin was a must have.  NCAA Bball is a point guard league.  You can't win, nor go far without them.  The crucial position.  The fact that Stan was after Larkin so much tells me he doesn't have faith in the PGs on this team as well.  If so you could wait for next years PG crop. 

Agreed... I am not sold either... We have some talent, but I don't feel as confident with any of these guys as i did having someone like Howard running the show, even with 2 acl injuries. 

[Velcro]

That clearly points out that Heath as HC needs at least 1 bulldog recruiter, a true go getter with connections.

Or, alternatively, it shows how **** tough it is to recruit here at USF. Greenberg was probably the most competent recruiter of all the coaches we had, and even he had a tough time putting a proper team together.

Exactly .... Seth did a good job recruiting before and after USF ... Stan did a good job recruitin before USF. That just can't be ignored.

Ironic thing is the USF coach with the least amount of recruiting credentials has 2 of his guys in the NBA. .... Go figure.

I think it points out both situations... a bull dog recruiter STILL might not be enough to overcome our image in general.  This is a truly tough place to recruit.

[Triple B]

I'm not sold on our PG position with this team.  That is why Larkin was a must have.  NCAA Bball is a point guard league.  You can't win, nor go far without them.  The crucial position.  The fact that Stan was after Larkin so much tells me he doesn't have faith in the PGs on this team as well.  If so you could wait for next years PG crop. 

Agreed... I am not sold either... We have some talent, but I don't feel as confident with any of these guys as i did having someone like Howard running the show, even with 2 acl injuries. 

I think it's going to be stranger not seeing Howard out there moreso than DoJo ...

[Bullpride08]

That clearly points out that Heath as HC needs at least 1 bulldog recruiter, a true go getter with connections.

Or, alternatively, it shows how **** tough it is to recruit here at USF. Greenberg was probably the most competent recruiter of all the coaches we had, and even he had a tough time putting a proper team together.

Exactly .... Seth did a good job recruiting before and after USF ... Stan did a good job recruitin before USF. That just can't be ignored.

Ironic thing is the USF coach with the least amount of recruiting credentials has 2 of his guys in the NBA. .... Go figure.

Greenberg was a very good recruiter but he also didnt' have the material to work with that Heath possesses.  Seth was recruiting in a marginally good C-USA hoops, not the BE, he never had the full athletic facility at his disposal...Seth had to tour players through the dungeon (the gym inside the SunDome)...can you imagine if Seth had the athletic facility, or the larger budget Heath has, or the improvements in the SunDome?

Also stop with the 'stan did a good job recruiting before USF'....where?  At Arkansas well join the club.  It's impossible to be sure how good of a recruiter Stan was since ARK afforded him the very best of everything, and they were a national power before he arrived in Fayetteville, ARK.  Hell most of his ARK assistants refused to take the pay-cut to come to Tampa...that should tell you all you need to know.

Stan's efforts elsewhere are a bit odd.  USF hasn't signed a big name coach from a bigger program since Lee Rose, and Lee had a long-established name.  Stan's career has been an odd set of occurences.  He was at Michigan State for 5 years, a school that recruits itself especially with Izzo who's a dynamic recruiter himself, and Stan got a name there for his coaching prowess-- not his recruiting prowess.  Then he goes to Kent State where he had one magical year, and clearly that had nothing to do with his recruiting since he wasn't there for more than 14 months but it showed the type of bench coach he could be.  He parlays that fortune into the Arkansas gig...where he had good success recruiting but not great...during his 5 years at ARK he had two top 20 recruiting classes in 2006 and 2004.  But remember before his arrival in 2001 ARK had a top 10 class.

Today Phelphrey has the #4 rated class if signing day was today, and he signed the 10th best class in 2008....worlds better than anything Heath signed at ARK.  He did well turning ARK's program around but trying to document his career, or rather labeling him as a 'great recruiter' is a stretch partly because of the odd-ball way his career has taken him.  The best thing you can say about Heath is that he's a good coach, good at developing talent, and bench coaching...his recruiting abilities certainly seem solid but he's not Greenberg either (who has signed 4 top 25 classes for Vtech since leaving USF) which is why increasing the budget to afford him better recruiters would help the program.

BTW, it is an oddity that our two highest NBA picks were found and signed by McCullum.  Go figure.