USF Struck Gold With CAG! He didn’t just cry…

[goingbackbull]

On 9/30/2023 at 11:45 PM, Gismo said:

Even FSU couldn’t keep a winning coach. 
 

But I do have to wonder if guys like Taggart or Frost or Herman ever regret their moves. They both flopped at their next stop. They both built more competitive teams at the USF and UCF and Houston than they did at FSU or Nebraska or Texas. 

Their careers are proof that a coaches winning formula at one school in one conference often doesn’t work at another university and conference.

If you build a team that wins the conference and is winning new years bowl games or in the playoff conversion, it’s hard to be certain that success can be repeated at a different university. Now there are some truely great coaches like Urban Meyer and Nick Saban who win a national championship at two universities, but take a look at Jimbo Fisher who has yet to even win the SEC West after 6 years despite having won a national championship at FSU. 
 

Would love to see a winning coach turn down a bump in money and name brand and instead just keep winning where it’s been working for them. 

Had this talk with people the other day.   If I'm making 2.5 mill and doing well at my job with little stress, why in my right mind would I leave to go to an SEC school knowing if I don't turn that program around in 2-3 years  I'm done.  I am living a great life making 2.5 Mill, my stress level is 75% lower than it would be at an SEC school.   But the difference between these guys and us normal Joe's is that these guys confidence is at such a high level that I can't even comprehend.   They truly believe they will win and win big at whatever school they are at.   I was offered a job making double what I was making.   I would have had to move. My fear of failure and being stuck in Austin Texas without a job was the reason I turned it down.   BTW it turned out to be a good choice as I found out later the comapnies management was awful and I probably would have been out a job even if I was uber successful 

[MaltLiquorBull]

4 minutes ago, goingbackbull said:

Had this talk with people the other day.   If I'm making 2.5 mill and doing well at my job with little stress, why in my right mind would I leave to go to an SEC school knowing if I don't turn that program around in 2-3 years  I'm done.  I am living a great life making 2.5 Mill, my stress level is 75% lower than it would be at an SEC school.   But the difference between these guys and us normal Joe's is that these guys confidence is at such a high level that I can't even comprehend.   They truly believe they will win and win big at whatever school they are at.   I was offered a job making double what I was making.   I would have had to move. My fear of failure and being stuck in Austin Texas without a job was the reason I turned it down.   BTW it turned out to be a good choice as I found out later the comapnies management was awful and I probably would have been out a job even if I was uber successful 

And there's also the uprooting of the family to move.  New town.  New schools.  Having to leave friends behind.  It's a difficult thing to have to ask them to do.  Coach referred to this in the post game.

[Bull94]

27 minutes ago, goingbackbull said:

Had this talk with people the other day.   If I'm making 2.5 mill and doing well at my job with little stress, why in my right mind would I leave to go to an SEC school knowing if I don't turn that program around in 2-3 years  I'm done.  I am living a great life making 2.5 Mill, my stress level is 75% lower than it would be at an SEC school.   But the difference between these guys and us normal Joe's is that these guys confidence is at such a high level that I can't even comprehend.   They truly believe they will win and win big at whatever school they are at.   I was offered a job making double what I was making.   I would have had to move. My fear of failure and being stuck in Austin Texas without a job was the reason I turned it down.   BTW it turned out to be a good choice as I found out later the comapnies management was awful and I probably would have been out a job even if I was uber successful 

Tenn coach makes $9m per year. he could get a guaranteed 5 year contract ($45m)that could set his family up for life and then walk into a truly stress free tv gig like many of the failures do.

Not sure what you make but doubling 100's of thousands to make a move is far different than tripling multiple millions

[TallyBull]

On 9/30/2023 at 11:45 PM, Gismo said:

But I do have to wonder if guys like Taggart or Frost or Herman ever regret their moves. They both flopped at their next stop. They both built more competitive teams at the USF and UCF and Houston than they did at FSU or Nebraska or Texas. 

It's a good point. I would think that the best college football coaching job in America would be to coach one of the top G5 programs. So long as you have access to the CFP, you've got a much easier path to getting there than say, at Purdue in the B1G. Rack up wins, and you could become a god at your school and still make many, many millions of dollars doing something you love. 

I understand the counterargument of course, - that these coaches are usually hyper-competitive types who do it not just for the money, but also the ego boost of competing at the highest levels of college football. But based on recent experiences (Taggart, Frost, Herman, etc.) it seems way more likely that you'll end up losing too many games and getting fired pretty quickly at a place like FSU, Nebraska, or Texas, because the expectations are so ridiculously high and largely unachievable. 

Just my opinion, but it seems the ideal situation is one where you coach, say, USF to multiple AAC championships, which eventually gets USF into a top-tier conference, and you try to make your mark from there - a platform where you are already beloved and less likely to get curb stomped in a year or two if you don't win 10 games each year. In the meantime, you're set for life financially.

[Bull94]

7 minutes ago, TallyBull said:

It's a good point. I would think that the best college football coaching job in America would be to coach one of the top G5 programs. So long as you have access to the CFP, you've got a much easier path to getting there than say, at Purdue in the B1G. Rack up wins, and you could become a god at your school and still make many, many millions of dollars doing something you love. 

I understand the counterargument of course, - that these coaches are usually hyper-competitive types who do it not just for the money, but also the ego boost of competing at the highest levels of college football. But based on recent experiences (Taggart, Frost, Herman, etc.) it seems way more likely that you'll end up losing too many games and getting fired pretty quickly at a place like FSU, Nebraska, or Texas, because the expectations are so ridiculously high and largely unachievable. 

Just my opinion, but it seems the ideal situation is one where you coach, say, USF to multiple AAC championships, which eventually gets USF into a top-tier conference, and you try to make your mark from there - a platform where you are already beloved and less likely to get curb stomped in a year or two if you don't win 10 games each year. In the meantime, you're set for life financially.

with that mindset, why would Taggart ever leave his cush job at WKU? His alma mater.

Might as well stay a position coach or coordinator. why take the risk of being a HC

Plenty of people are happy working in a cubicle their entire lives.

Some people want to run the biggest and best companies they can. They tend to be risk takers. Extremely competitive.

[TallyBull]

1 hour ago, Bull94 said:

with that mindset, why would Taggart ever leave his cush job at WKU? His alma mater.

Might as well stay a position coach or coordinator. why take the risk of being a HC

Plenty of people are happy working in a cubicle their entire lives.

Some people want to run the biggest and best companies they can. They tend to be risk takers. Extremely competitive.

WKU is not one of the top tier G5 programs. I would define a top tier G5 program as one located at an academically top-tier university in a large market with lots of upside (like USF), where you can get lots of exposure if you win and millions of dollars to coach. Taking the risk of being a HC makes sense because it pays far more than being a position coach or coordinator and gives you greater control of the program. And anyways, there's no job or financial security for position coaches/coordinators. 

No one said anything about not pursuing greater opportunities if you want to (taking the risk is fine, I respect that) - I just made the observation that you can definitely have a great career even if you're not coaching in a power five conference, and that it might actually be easier to rack up a lot of wins that way if you're a great coach. You can still become a legend and make millions of dollars (maybe not as many millions, but at some point money is no longer the primary motivation). 

I acknowledged your point about some people being uber-competitive in my original post. I agree. However, to suggest that a coach deciding to strategically remain at a top tier G5 school (at least for more than the standard 2 or 3-year stint) means you're not competitive or a risk taker is a mistake IMO. Not all opportunities in a "power" conference are as good or better than coaching at a top tier G5 school. I completely understand why a very successful G5 coach might want to leave to coach at UF, Georgia, or Ohio State. Harder to understand why he'd want to leave for a "power" school that is almost never in the CFP conversation and is highly unlikely to ever be. 

Edited October 2, 2023 by TallyBull

[Bull Matrix]

18 minutes ago, TallyBull said:

WKU is not one of the top tier G5 programs. I would define a top tier G5 program as one located at an academically top-tier university in a large market with lots of upside (like USF), where you can get lots of exposure if you win and millions of dollars to coach. Taking the risk of being a HC makes sense because it pays far more than being a position coach or coordinator and gives you greater control of the program. And anyways, there's no job or financial security for position coaches/coordinators. 

No one said anything about not pursuing greater opportunities if you want to (taking the risk is fine, I respect that) - I just made the observation that you can definitely have a great career even if you're not coaching in a power five conference, and that it might actually be easier to rack up a lot of wins that way if you're a great coach. You can still become a legend and make millions of dollars (maybe not as many millions, but at some point money is no longer the primary motivation). 

I acknowledged your point about some people being uber-competitive in my original post. I agree. However, to suggest that a coach deciding to strategically remain at a top tier G5 school (at least for more than the standard 2 or 3-year stint) means you're not competitive or a risk taker is a mistake IMO. Not all opportunities in a "power" conference are as good or better than coaching at a top tier G5 school. I completely understand why a very successful G5 coach might want to leave to coach at UF, Georgia, or Ohio State. Harder to understand why he'd want to leave for a "power" school that is almost never in the CFP conversation and is highly unlikely to ever be. 

Agreed. USF has been in a BCS conference & on the verge of being invited to a power conference if things continue to improve 

[Mango028]

I think if we can get into a conference after year 2…year one we win 7-8 games. Year 2 we win conference and go 11-1…we get acc invite and then he stays for awhile and we cab pay him more as well as no incentive for him to leave as we could compete in a quicker turnaround in acc. I think we have him for 5-6 years minimum. He leaves only for his dream job comes open (not sure what even is) 

[Bull94]

1 hour ago, TallyBull said:

WKU is not one of the top tier G5 programs. I would define a top tier G5 program as one located at an academically top-tier university in a large market with lots of upside (like USF), where you can get lots of exposure if you win and millions of dollars to coach. Taking the risk of being a HC makes sense because it pays far more than being a position coach or coordinator and gives you greater control of the program. And anyways, there's no job or financial security for position coaches/coordinators. 

No one said anything about not pursuing greater opportunities if you want to (taking the risk is fine, I respect that) - I just made the observation that you can definitely have a great career even if you're not coaching in a power five conference, and that it might actually be easier to rack up a lot of wins that way if you're a great coach. You can still become a legend and make millions of dollars (maybe not as many millions, but at some point money is no longer the primary motivation). 

I acknowledged your point about some people being uber-competitive in my original post. I agree. However, to suggest that a coach deciding to strategically remain at a top tier G5 school (at least for more than the standard 2 or 3-year stint) means you're not competitive or a risk taker is a mistake IMO. Not all opportunities in a "power" conference are as good or better than coaching at a top tier G5 school. I completely understand why a very successful G5 coach might want to leave to coach at UF, Georgia, or Ohio State. Harder to understand why he'd want to leave for a "power" school that is almost never in the CFP conversation and is highly unlikely to ever be. 

Listen I think this is a good job but many of our fans think it's a destination job. It's not.

Most of these guys want to compete at the top.

Of course it would make more sense to stay here over a mid-level p4 job but if a top 25 job comes along I wouldn't be surprised if he left.

[jchem1995]

I believe that CAG will stick it out as long as we will have him. We can get a seat at the table. Eventually he will be in the position Gus found himself in at UCF. No real pressure from alumni/ fans, a chance to compete for a national title, a destination spot to live and recruit.