when do we fire Heath?

[bcgruber]

Then I guess Jay wright and Jamie Dixon should have been fired last year with this type of thinking

[Bulls 1]

 

 

http://www.tampabay.com/sports/basketball/college/usf-may-be-worst-offensive-team-in-big-east-history/1275799

 

 

USF may be the worst offensive team in Big East history -

 I'm may not have a basketball mind, but it never seems like we run any type of organized play.  Just 4 guys watching 1 guy dribble until someone has to throw up a desperation shot before the shot clock runs out.

It's called Heathball. Stan has been blessed to still be coaching this long. Very, very few if any ever get the opportunity to still call the shots with a resume even remotely close to Heath's. Now it helps tremendously to work for an AD like Doug Woolard who certainly wouldn't rank up there with many in job satisfaction. I'm very worried about the future of USF basketball under the leadership of Heath and Woolard.

 

Because we have such a great history in BB that they've run into the ground.

Wow!! are you saying it is OK to win 1 game in conference and have the worst offense in the Big East because that's our history!! 

[gobulls83]

 

 

 

http://www.tampabay.com/sports/basketball/college/usf-may-be-worst-offensive-team-in-big-east-history/1275799

 

 

USF may be the worst offensive team in Big East history -

 I'm may not have a basketball mind, but it never seems like we run any type of organized play.  Just 4 guys watching 1 guy dribble until someone has to throw up a desperation shot before the shot clock runs out.

It's called Heathball. Stan has been blessed to still be coaching this long. Very, very few if any ever get the opportunity to still call the shots with a resume even remotely close to Heath's. Now it helps tremendously to work for an AD like Doug Woolard who certainly wouldn't rank up there with many in job satisfaction. I'm very worried about the future of USF basketball under the leadership of Heath and Woolard.

 

Because we have such a great history in BB that they've run into the ground.

Wow!! are you saying it is OK to win 1 game in conference and have the worst offense in the Big East because that's our history!! 

 

No, he's saying to expect the team to go from among the worst in a major conference to perennial NCAA tournament team overnight is dumb as hell. This season sucks, but it's not shocking that it happened, and it doesn't suddenly undo everything that was awesome about last season. Try and gain some perspective.

[Triple B]

 

 

 

http://www.tampabay.com/sports/basketball/college/usf-may-be-worst-offensive-team-in-big-east-history/1275799

 

 

USF may be the worst offensive team in Big East history -

 I'm may not have a basketball mind, but it never seems like we run any type of organized play.  Just 4 guys watching 1 guy dribble until someone has to throw up a desperation shot before the shot clock runs out.

It's called Heathball. Stan has been blessed to still be coaching this long. Very, very few if any ever get the opportunity to still call the shots with a resume even remotely close to Heath's. Now it helps tremendously to work for an AD like Doug Woolard who certainly wouldn't rank up there with many in job satisfaction. I'm very worried about the future of USF basketball under the leadership of Heath and Woolard.

 

Because we have such a great history in BB that they've run into the ground.

Wow!! are you saying it is OK to win 1 game in conference and have the worst offense in the Big East because that's our history!! 

 

[Vega]

Then I guess Jay wright and Jamie Dixon should have been fired last year with this type of thinking

 

I'm going to be nice as I can with this.

When you have coached as long as Heath, Wright, and Dixon you build up a track record. It's like in baseball when a good hitter or good pitcher is struggling or slumping. You often hear the long time followers of the game say don't worry such and such will eventaually start hitting like the stats on the back of his card say he does. Such -n- such will start pitching like the stats on his card say he will. There is a reason why nobody worries much when a Derek Jeter or a Justin Verlander goes through a bad stretch, history shows that they have been consistently good throughout their careers. The logic applies to Jamie Dixon and Jay Wright in basketball. Both two very successful coaches that had a bad season by their standards. History proves that wouldn't last and it didn't. Jay Wright has career record at Nova of 246 - 125. He had a string of 13 straight Post season tournament appearances going back to his days at Hofstra.  Jamie Dixon is considered one of the best coaching in the nation. Often praised for getting the most out of his talent, which has been lesser then many top programs(Heath would probably be the exact opposite of Dixon). At Pitt, Dixon has a record of 258 - 84. Has coached in the post season every year at Pitt and will again this year.

 

Now resumes work both ways, while the paragraph above shows examples of guys who deserve the benefit of the doubt when they go through a bad stretch because they have proven to be successful winners. Then we have a guy like a Stan Heath, that history has showed he most likely isn't capable of any sustained success or great levels of achievements. Take the example of baseball again, we see every year some veteran guys get off to hot starts hitting and some pitching, but eventually they come back down to the level that they have displayed their entire careers. History shows it just doesn't last, winners are winners and losers are losers. Stan Heath's Kent St record was 30-6. Since then Mr Stanley Heath(the 3rd) is 165 - 176 as a Head Coach. You give coaches like Willie Taggart a chance to prove himself because he's just really starting his coaching career. With Vets like Dixon, Wright, and Heath you already know what they can do.

[bcgruber]

Again you are not comparing apples to apples Pitt and Nova have been established programs for a long time and those coaches have been at those schools the whole time as well.  Stan has been with a down Arkansas program and turned them into a 3 time NCAA team.  And USF was in one or the worst shapes of any basketball school BCS or non BCS.  He has taken us to 1 NCAA and one NIT in the last 3 years.  You must look at the situation for what it is.  This year has been awful and some of the blame needs to be placed on the academic issues associated with W. Austin.  Now some blame goes to stan for not having anyone else to take the place of that loss, but again this isn't a high level program where you have the luxary of having many quality players sitting on the bench.  Next years recruiting class along with what Stan has done the previous 3 years gives him the benefit of the doubt.  Now if 3 years from now we are having seasons like this that is another topic for discussion.  I know you have not been a fan of his and keep saying coaches would love to coach for a school that doesn't expect much and keep their job, but has taken this program from the very bottom, thats what it needs to be compared to, 

[gobulls83]

That batting average analogy is up there on the very short list for most ridiculous things you've ever posted on this board. Derek Jeter has a lot more control over his own batting average than a college basketball coach does his team's winning percentage. USF had a history of losing when Heath came on board. He started in the hole. This is WAY more of a problem for a college basketball (or football) team to have than for a pro team, because of the nature of recruiting and how revenue is generated in college sports. Derek Jeter doesn't start every at-bat with one or two strikes against him already, and that's more akin to what Heath took on here. Jamie Dixon is a fine coach, but he didn't start in this six-foot hole that Heath did when he took his current job. Dixon way back in 2003 took over a team that had gone to back-to-back Sweet Sixteens and won consecutive Big East titles.

 

Jay Wright took over a crap team and turned them around almost immediately - by which I mean they went to the NIT his first season, went dancing the next year, then he got caught up in a scandal that led to almost half his team being suspended. Just like a big-time program I guess. Anyway, the team he took over still wasn't the perennial basement dweller that USF was when Heath came on board.

[Triple B]

You guys need to just give it up. The kid doesn't just doesn't have a clue, thinking all programs are created equal and coaches are the only difference between them. Taking nothing away from either of those coaches, they probably would have been successful almost anywhere they went, but Dixon stepped into a great situation left by Howland and Villanova was the perfect place for ex-Massimino assistant, Wright. 

 

No Bulls fans are giving Stan a lifetime contract but what he has accomplished so far has given him the time to see if he can bring some consistency to the program ...

[Vega]

I love this thread and hopefully it keeps going.

 

Every pitiful reply like the one bull83 gave...again just reinforces my belief that Stan Heath has the most comfortable coaching job in America. I hesitated to write that because I just knew it would be way over somebody's head and what do you know...it was.

I love Triple B and his woeful USF can't be expected to do better speeches and since we are mediocre we should just accept a mediocre head coaching. "Hey we are USF and we suck so what's the big deal? We've sucked this long so might as well suck some more, who knows maybe we'll get a crumb tossed our way eventually."

Triple I like you and always have, but you lost me a few year ago when you said that you rather go to the NIT instead of the NCAAT.

To think that coaches don't make or can't make a difference is asinine. I never said or even thought that USF was a job where there wasn't work that needed to be done. However this notion that you can't win consistently here isn't true anymore. It can be done and I don't know what program you think just is born good without working at it. USF isn't the only program that had to overcome disadvantages to change the perception and the culture from losing to winning. It's been done and will continue to be done as long as the rules of the game remain the same. To do that starts with having the right people in charge in the Athletic Department on down.

I'm sure you will continue to disagree and that's fine, I'm never going to convince you or the others of what I think and you all aren't going to change my way of thinking. We all can just agree to disagree...

 

I'll be back on this board in a week or so, have fun my friends.

[DELdaBull]

Good Vega talks about bball recruiting.

Bad Vega talks about Stan Heath.