Fenelly: "USF Dropping The Ball If It Drops UCF"

[BULLheaded]

...but ignoring you benefits only OUR team,

Can you clarify this a bit?? I'm not saying you're wrong, but I don't understand how USF benefits from NOT playing the game.

We have the edge right now, due to a stroke of luck we have the BCS tag and we have access (regardless of likelihood) to a national championship and/or a BCS bid UCF doesn't. This means we have no need to play this game to set up apart. It is now on the shoulders of UCF to prove to recruits that they are on par with us and the only way they can do that is to play. We benefit by completely taking away any hope they have of "proving" they are on our level.

So basically they give us nothing, we give them hope.

[Bull Dozer]

Well the only difference between FAU, FIU and UCF is that UCF is a little closer. That just isn't a reason to create a rivalry.

Actually, no.  UCF is in a better conference and has a better team.

Also, there has been competition between USF and UCF in other sports and in other ways for quite some time...

Fifteen years ago there was the same disdain between USF and UCF... that was before USF even started down the path to a football...

Do you really think the average fan in Tampa 1)looks at UCF any differently than the other two? and 2)cares at all about any games we've played in soccer or tennis? No I don't see anything about this that will generate a lasting interest in the area.

I'm sorry if it bothers a few people that being part of the "little two" is less then exciting, I'm just glad our program is just as uninterested.

The average fan in tampa is a bandwagon fan period, end of story, thanks for coming out.  Look at the buc's the stadium wasnt packed TILL THEY STARTED WINNING, same with the lightning.  And yes USF had a good record but in college football winning means competeing for a conference championship every year (and i mean seriously competeing not just being in the middle of the pack) and a national championship every few years.  When this starts happening USF will gain the average fan, because right now they are at a sports bar watching one of the big 3 on saturdays.  Once we start to seriously vie for conference championships every year those fans will see that they can see high quality football live right in their own back yard.  The same way it did with the other two franchises in the city that went from low attendence and a losing record to packed houses and rabid fans.  Basically if you supporting this program now and have been for atleast 5 years you are a die hard, the casual fan will come when we can consistantly field a team to challenge for a conference championship EVERY YEAR.  

[BULLheaded]

Well the only difference between FAU, FIU and UCF is that UCF is a little closer. That just isn't a reason to create a rivalry.

Actually, no.  UCF is in a better conference and has a better team.

Also, there has been competition between USF and UCF in other sports and in other ways for quite some time...

Fifteen years ago there was the same disdain between USF and UCF... that was before USF even started down the path to a football...

Do you really think the average fan in Tampa 1)looks at UCF any differently than the other two? and 2)cares at all about any games we've played in soccer or tennis? No I don't see anything about this that will generate a lasting interest in the area.

I'm sorry if it bothers a few people that being part of the "little two" is less then exciting, I'm just glad our program is just as uninterested.

The average fan in tampa is a bandwagon fan period, end of story, thanks for coming out.  Look at the buc's the stadium wasnt packed TILL THEY STARTED WINNING, same with the lightning.  And yes USF had a good record but in college football winning means competeing for a conference championship every year (and i mean seriously competeing not just being in the middle of the pack) and a national championship every few years.  When this starts happening USF will gain the average fan, because right now they are at a sports bar watching one of the big 3 on saturdays.  Once we start to seriously vie for conference championships every year those fans will see that they can see high quality football live right in their own back yard.  The same way it did with the other two franchises in the city that went from low attendence and a losing record to packed houses and rabid fans.  Basically if you supporting this program now and have been for atleast 5 years you are a die hard, the casual fan will come when we can consistantly field a team to challenge for a conference championship EVERY YEAR.  

Your right, and guess what that would be the case with or without UCF on the schedule. So again, this game is not beneficial.

[Joe]

Do you really think the average fan in Tampa 1)looks at UCF any differently than the other two? and 2)cares at all about any games we've played in soccer or tennis? No I don't see anything about this that will generate a lasting interest in the area.

I'm sorry if it bothers a few people that being part of the "little two" is less then exciting, I'm just glad our program is just as uninterested.

1) Yes, only about 20,000 fans showed for FIU, 40,000 showed for UCF...I think thats a large difference in the number of fans at the game.

2) No they don't but I'm sure they know things have existed between the schools before.

As for the novelty, yes it could wear off, or it could get bigger no one knows yet. I will say this you have a better chance of developing a great rivalry with UCF than Louisville.

The distance, the fact that Louisville will always have a bigger rival (UK), a game they have played against a team 2 hours away for 40 years (Cincy), and the fact that they probably consider WVU their biggest BE rival (for obvious reasons) will slow down the chances. Does that mean it won't be a good game? No. But I also don't see this as some type of blood thirsty rivalry.

Does that mean UCF will be a rival? No. But I think there are more pieces in place for such a game.

[Knight_Light]

Well the only difference between FAU, FIU and UCF is that UCF is a little closer. That just isn't a reason to create a rivalry.

Actually, no.  UCF is in a better conference and has a better team.

Also, there has been competition between USF and UCF in other sports and in other ways for quite some time...

Fifteen years ago there was the same disdain between USF and UCF... that was before USF even started down the path to a football...

Do you really think the average fan in Tampa 1)looks at UCF any differently than the other two? (FAU & FIU)and 2)cares at all about any games we've played in soccer or tennis? No I don't see anything about this that will generate a lasting interest in the area.

I'm sorry if it bothers a few people that being part of the "little two" is less then exciting, I'm just glad our program is just as uninterested.

Yes.

UCF at USF: 45,000 plus fans at RJS (announced)

FIU at USF: 27,000 plus fans at RJS

Sure seems that fans in TAMPA do see the difference in those 2 teams...heck...fans in Tampa seem to think playing UCF (who hadn't won a game since Oct 2003) is even better than playing # 9 Louisville...since the UCF game had a crowd that was 12,000 plus larger than the USF/UL game!!

Thanks for helping me make a great point!

Couldn't of done it without ya!

KL

[Bull Dozer]

Well the only difference between FAU, FIU and UCF is that UCF is a little closer. That just isn't a reason to create a rivalry.

Actually, no.  UCF is in a better conference and has a better team.

Also, there has been competition between USF and UCF in other sports and in other ways for quite some time...

Fifteen years ago there was the same disdain between USF and UCF... that was before USF even started down the path to a football...

Do you really think the average fan in Tampa 1)looks at UCF any differently than the other two? and 2)cares at all about any games we've played in soccer or tennis? No I don't see anything about this that will generate a lasting interest in the area.

I'm sorry if it bothers a few people that being part of the "little two" is less then exciting, I'm just glad our program is just as uninterested.

The average fan in tampa is a bandwagon fan period, end of story, thanks for coming out.  Look at the buc's the stadium wasnt packed TILL THEY STARTED WINNING, same with the lightning.  And yes USF had a good record but in college football winning means competeing for a conference championship every year (and i mean seriously competeing not just being in the middle of the pack) and a national championship every few years.  When this starts happening USF will gain the average fan, because right now they are at a sports bar watching one of the big 3 on saturdays.  Once we start to seriously vie for conference championships every year those fans will see that they can see high quality football live right in their own back yard.  The same way it did with the other two franchises in the city that went from low attendence and a losing record to packed houses and rabid fans.  Basically if you supporting this program now and have been for atleast 5 years you are a die hard, the casual fan will come when we can consistantly field a team to challenge for a conference championship EVERY YEAR.  

Your right, and guess what that would be the case with or without UCF on the schedule. So again, this game is not beneficial.

In my opinion this game should be in week two replacing one of the cupcakes we always have.  Their program is equal to ours in national media eyes (and even ahead of us in some cases) so how does it hurt us, especially nationally?  With the way ESPN slobs O'Leary wouldnt it be nice to get a win over a club who recieved a good amount of national attention so far this season?  If we lose they see it as UF losing to say georgia or LSU, basically we would be losing to a team that is capable of beating us (or in alot of cases should beat us i.e vegas), so there is no step back here.  Alot of people on this board have such a small and narrow scope about how our program is viewed nationally.  This is a good game for us it should remain on the schedule until its proved that we are leagues ahead of them (or even vice versa, yeah thats right i said it) and the game no longer becomes competitve, or we can get UCF type numbers at the stadium and away games against most other opponents.      

[Guest]

...but ignoring you benefits only OUR team,

Can you clarify this a bit?? I'm not saying you're wrong, but I don't understand how USF benefits from NOT playing the game.

We have the edge right now, due to a stroke of luck we have the BCS tag and we have access (regardless of likelihood) to a national championship and/or a BCS bid UCF doesn't. This means we have no need to play this game to set up apart. It is now on the shoulders of UCF to prove to recruits that they are on par with us and the only way they can do that is to play. We benefit by completely taking away any hope they have of "proving" they are on our level.

So basically they give us nothing, we give them hope.

You didn't really answer the question and contradict yourself.

I agree that UCF is not on USF's level because USF is in a BCS conference.  How does playing (or beating) us change that?  How does scheduling the games for the next 20 years give them the ability to prove they are on our level?  How does the series give them hope?

Well, it doesn't.  So by not playing the game, you are not taking anything away from UCF.

Therefore, I still don't see any real benefit in NOT playing the game.

[Triple B]

Trip, your fans don't even travel to RayJay.  I think the lack of ticket sales for away games is a problem that needs to be solved at home first.

You're exactly right, we should ..... and until then, why should we give UCF almost another home game and get nothing out of it that we couldn't get by scheduling FAMU every other year?

[MavTechKNIGHT2]

As for recruiting, how many recruits did we "steal" from Louisville by beating them last year? How many recruits did we lose after the WVU game? How many recruits do you see switching to UCF if we lose the game? I don't know much about recruiting but I would like to know if a win or a loss really make that much of a difference since that is one of the arguments against playing UCF.

I agree.  Do we really go head to head with UCF for many players?

You can count on one hand the number of players on our roster from the "Central Florida" area.  

There are a few players each year that we both go after.

UCF currently has 3 verbals from kids that had USF offers.

[BULLheaded]

...but ignoring you benefits only OUR team,

Can you clarify this a bit?? I'm not saying you're wrong, but I don't understand how USF benefits from NOT playing the game.

We have the edge right now, due to a stroke of luck we have the BCS tag and we have access (regardless of likelihood) to a national championship and/or a BCS bid UCF doesn't. This means we have no need to play this game to set up apart. It is now on the shoulders of UCF to prove to recruits that they are on par with us and the only way they can do that is to play. We benefit by completely taking away any hope they have of "proving" they are on our level.

So basically they give us nothing, we give them hope.

You didn't really answer the question and contradict yourself.

I agree that UCF is not on USF's level because USF is in a BCS conference.  How does playing (or beating) us change that?  How does scheduling the games for the next 20 years give them the ability to prove they are on our level?  How does the series give them hope?

Well, it doesn't.  So by not playing the game, you are not taking anything away from UCF.

How did I contradict myself? I believe that the only way that UCF will be able to compete with recruits will be to beat us on the field, just because you think that won't happen does not mean I'm contradicting a thing. I think they are the team that is closest to us in battling for recruits and by not giving them assistence in that arena is a benefit to us. Again, just because you don't agree doesn't mean that I'm contradicting myself. Somehow I think most people that are dying for this "rivalry" are really just expecting that we are so far ahead of them that it will just be a game that we'll win and can rub it in their face. Unfortunately I think we are closer than most others do and have a real chance of blowing some of these games, if that happens I hope you all come back here talking up the benefits that a loss to them gave us. I can guarantee you if that happens they'll be trying to use it every way possible to give them leverage.