Fat, Drunk, and Stupid is no way to go through life, USF

[CousinRicky]

Depending on how you want to define a "commuter school", USF probably fits the definition as only 15% of students live on campus http://www.stateuniversity.com/universities/FL/University_of_South_Florida.html. Many more live in the surrounding area but I don't believe that fits the strict definition of living on campus.

Coming from NJ, I mentioned to a former boss of mine that my daughter was probably going to USF. He said, "Oh, that's a commuter school". So in 2002 it was known as that to some obscure person in NJ.

[CousinRicky]

As for not being an AAU university, there are a lot of schools that don't have that honor. Here is a link to those that are http://www.aau.edu/about/default.aspx?id=5476

[TherapyBull]

I love this university and bleed green and gold, but let’s look at some things.

Large Commuter School

Non AAU Member

Abysmal 6 year graduation rates

Ranked 170th Nationally by US News

Relatively new football program

Plays home games in an NFL stadium, 12 miles from campus

Has actual attendance around 30K for non-marquee matchups.

Never finished higher than 3rd in the Big East, Never finished ranked.

1 NCAA Basketball tournament in 20 years.

Resides in the 13th largest media market.

Looking at this, it is pretty clear that USF is where it is supposed to be in terms of conference re-alignment. The only thing we have going for us is the large media market, but all the other schools in this conference were chosen for that reason too. The Big East gave us a huge gift because they wanted to maintain a presence in Florida, our lot never improved.

What if we are stuck in this conference for the next 5 years? If things do not improve, what makes us think we will be first in line to get into another conference? Yes, Florida has fertile recruiting grounds and maybe FSU will bolt for another conference at some point. However, we cannot bank that in 5 years USF will be in a better position than UCF under that mindset. The Big 12 might not choose to expand to Florida, we just don’t know.

Instead of blaming others I hope we start looking at some of these things, and look for ways to improve. Administration and the fan base should take ownership. I for one will continue to support USF athletics via donations and attendance at football games. I will make it a point to have all 6 of my season tickets used. I will also continue to press administration to improve academics. We have to take some responsibility.

What scares me the most is the entitlement mindset, and that we somehow deserve to be at the table with the big boys. Let’s sit idle and see if we get picked up. Sure if the ACC or Big 12 came calling we would gladly accept, but that gift might not ever come.

Fat, Drunk, and Stupid is no way to go through life, lets clean up...........

Going to disagree with you on just about everything. The University of South Florida is one of the Premier research Universities in this state. AAU status will come with time. The money is there now but that is not enough. AAU membership requires results. Just look around you, USF just had a professor win educator of the year in the entire nation. The results are there as well and just need a few more years of proof. USF is no longer the fall back school kids are getting denied here and getting into FSU and other schools on a consistent basis now. I'm sure that works both ways, but not something you could say a few years ago. USF is also considered the one of the leaders of the up and coming institutions ranking top 5 yearly. Our academics are fine as I am sure University Presidents would be well aware of this information. I really hashed out at DW in the past but I know see the light. Our Administration knows that USF's way into a major conference is to bring to the table upgrades in ALL SPORTS. Football needs to catch up, basketball needs to stay hot, and baseball needs new leadership which will come after this season.

Commuter school. You can keep thinking that way, but that is not true anymore. Housing is full to the point where the school just put pressure to speed up the Fontana Hall property remodel project. It will be ready for the fall...

You disagree with everything yet you do not refute any of these claims that USF just does not stack up that well with the schools in the power conferences. Yes, we are certainly improving, Judy is doing a great job. But we are simply where we should be in terms of the conference situation.

Please lay to bed the OCS statement. Has it help UCF get into a better conference then the Big East? UCF a school whose recent athletic results are far superior to ours. Athletics and the university made a commitment to improve basketball and non-revenue sports facilities. They saw this mess on the horizon and reacted and did the smart thing. USF is not willing to build a metal disaster of a stadium just to say we have one. They choose to spread out our dozen eggs instead of laying them all in one basket. How anyone can say that was the wrong decision is shocking to me. Look at the state of the football program. So we put the 100 million down on a new stadium and build something like Minnesota has. Now we have a start of the art stadium for a currently failing program and awful facilities for every other sport. The correct decision was made and playing in Ray Jay is right for this university at this time.

I think we can all agree that nobody can win a stadium debate until after the fact. Then we can look back and see it the investment worked or not. With regards to UCF. USF was clearly ahead of them, we had beaten them every time, albeit the last one at their OCS was real close. UCF built a stadium and put together some nice seasons in Conference USA. UCF got a call up to the Big East when West Virginia, Louiseville, and Rutgers were still in the league. Looking back the Big East was still a very viable conference at the time. UCF is essentially on par with USF at this time, it's a coin flip. So yes, I'm going to say that their stadium has been successful. Is it the stadium? is it Leary? is it something else? I dont know. Also, very different circumstances, Citrus Bowl was crap. If you don't beleive me here is what the president of UCF thinks about the stadium. http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2011-01-15/sports/os-bianchi-john-hitt-ucf-20110115_1_ucf-president-john-hitt-ucf-football-bright-house-networks-stadium

Looking at conference realignment we know it is all about football, basketball is 20%, all other sports are essentially meaningless. Now I'm getting conflicting reports on this pen about whether administration knew conference realignment was coming, or that they made these facility upgrades expecting a 10 million dollar a year Big East TV deal. Which one is right? Looking back, and knowing football is the driver, and knowing football is the only entity that can make the fan base baramoter move in a meaningful manner, then yes I think it is an absolutely fair and almost expected question of administration. We can spread our eggs into many baskets, but there are only a couple of baskets that matter.

I agree those fields were terrible and we have RJS, not saying it is a wrong decision, but the question is fair.

[TherapyBull]

As for not being an AAU university, there are a lot of schools that don't have that honor. Here is a link to those that are http://www.aau.edu/a...lt.aspx?id=5476

Agreed, lots of quality programs do not have the AAU honor. In fact the SEC only had 2 schools that were AAU (Florida and Vandy) before accepting Texas AM and Missouri which are both AAU schools.

If you look at all the schools that have been moving around however, a clear pattern emerges. Pitt, Syracuse, Nebraska (Both Just Lost AAU status), Colorado, Rutgers, Maryland, Texas AM, Missouri, all AAU schools.

West Virginia and Louisville are not but they have huge fan bases, and Louisville went last when the Big East had no more AAU members left.

TCU is not but the Big12 needed a 10th team and they chose one from Texas.

Utah is not but the PAC 12 choose a good regional fit.

[nobull.Bulls]

You can either look to help USF as a fan and alumni who wants and does the best for their school (conference realignment) Or just mope around that we aren't good enough for your standards. I'm not thrilled at where USF yet (specifically football wise), but USF is far from done or complacent either.

[Sellular1]

Depending on how you want to define a "commuter school", USF probably fits the definition as only 15% of students live on campus http://www.stateuniversity.com/universities/FL/University_of_South_Florida.html. Many more live in the surrounding area but I don't believe that fits the strict definition of living on campus.

Coming from NJ, I mentioned to a former boss of mine that my daughter was probably going to USF. He said, "Oh, that's a commuter school". So in 2002 it was known as that to some obscure person in NJ.

I graduated in 1990, it was definitely a commuter school then. I have continued to visit over the years and marvel at the improvements. This year my daughter is graduating from HS and has been looking at schools. She got accepted to FSU, UF, Miami, and USF. She got scholarship offers for each school. She chose USF based on how new and impressive our campus is. Yes USF is on 1500 acres while FSU is on 400 acres, making it tougher to get around, but she likes the feel of USF much better. Her opinion of UF was "too mant rednecks and the town sux". Miami was "too many foreigners and the town sucks". USF, close to the beach, good school, and brand new amenities. Things are definitely moving in the right direction. Go Bulls.

[TherapyBull]

You can either look to help USF as a fan and alumni who wants and does the best for their school (conference realignment) Or just mope around that we aren't good enough for your standards. I'm not thrilled at where USF yet (specifically football wise), but USF is far from done or complacent either.

Exactly my point, take an active role and support the university, not blame others or expect we deserve a seat in a better conference.

[nobull.Bulls]

I agree with you except for on that last point. It really isn't about Deserve in conference realignment (ex: Syracuse and Pitt football). It is about who has the tv market that other conferences find desirable.

[Florida Bull]

I think when anti-USF critics call the university a "commuter school," they are doing more than just emphasizing the students who live off-campus. The purpose is to imply inferior academics-if not also just a level above community college. It may not be the literal definition, but that is the cultural reference when people demean USF as a "commuter school" as it is trying to associate with other top 200 undergraduate programs.

Of course a "commuter school" having an average incoming freshman gpa around 3.9, an acceptance rate around 40% (I believe 38% in 2010), a top 50 research ranking, and top 10 for US patents (in two consecutive years) is hardly bad.

Edited December 15, 2012 by Florida Bull

[TherapyBull]

Yes USF has made great strides; Yes Judy has done a great job on the academic side of things. Yes the campus is improving. Yes USF is a better university each and every year. But it does not matter when you were on the campus. Everyone on this board loves this university with a passion, and wants to see it succeed. Our current resume is our current resume. The conferences do not care where we came from; they care where we are now. Where we are now does not match up well with the schools in the “Big conferencesâ€. Improvement is always great, but it is no guarantee that we will make the jump onto the next level. Potential is just that, Potential. We may or may not materialize.

Academic snobbery still persists, and rating systems are heavily skewed towards undergraduate. USF pulls in a lot of research, but that is on the graduate side of things. The commuter school moniker is not a death sentence in and of itself, it does however become a factor when we do not graduate our students, and nobody is arguing that this is not a problem.

Here is an article from the Tampa Bay Times

http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/venturebiz/content/florida-university-systems-still-way-behind-usfs-graduation-rate-sore-need-improvement

“One of USF's Achilles heels is this ranking is its abysmally low rate 6-year graduation rate.â€

“USF realizes it's not remotely competitive on its 6-year graduation rate. What's alarming is that low graduation rate has not changed much in the past five years. (USF's 4-year graduation rate for first-time-in-college students is a troubling 34 percent.)â€

It is scary, we all feel the university has been making changes, but it is not translating into this very important statistic.

6 year graduation rates

UF = 84 percent

FSU = 74 percent

UCF = 63 percent

USF = 52 percent

We can make excuses all day, but it still does not replace these objective measures on our current resume, and that is what my whole point was about. If you look objectively, we are in the conference we should be in. We need to improve on these measures and I will continue to support the school in its efforts both in the classroom and on the feild of sports.