Rejected by Penn State, signing with RU?

[BDYZR]

Let me see if I understand this.

bp08 thinks CJL should recruit players that may or may not make it in academics, AND stake his reputation on it?

Isn't that alittle like Russian Roulette?

[Apis Bull]

He was accepted into UL, RU, Nebraska, and two SEC, and two B10 schools were hot on his trail.

How was he "accepted" into all those schools?  Don't you have to wait for him to sign an LOI before you go through the acceptance process?  Or did he send his transcripts to each of those schools like any average student would have to?

[Bullpride08]

Cyber, why don't you speculate a little more  :....can you stop spoon feeding me the pumpyoufullofagoodtime USF crap.  I know about what happened with Joyer, and USF went on a witch hunt...got them real far too.  Results:  Joyer made it into UL without a hiccup, the NCAA passed on the issue, and Pasco County is now thoroughly pissed at us for questioning them.

But hey, whatever floats your boat.

BDYZR...what do you think football coaches do already?  What do you think leavitt did before this committee?  Russian Roulette?  Don't be naive my friend, this is a big business, and coaches know what is at stake.  My friend Cyber wants to add a bunch of layers to hold his coach's hand.  My argument is if a coach needs that much hand holding than maybe he needs to be put on a tighter leash, and soon shown the door if improvements don't happen sooner.

Leavitt's been signing players for over a decade that may or may not make it in academics, AND he stakes his reputation on it too!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  What planet have you been living on BDYZR...some of our best players, and ambassadors to the program were borderline academics like Henry, Blackwell, and Rubin.  Jeez, let's not rewrite history here boys.

[redfisher78]

Bp08, no one is asking for 1400 SAT. And as far as Joyer was concerned, they found out that on several occasions his grades were incorrect and had to be changed back to lower one. Also, the principal for his school was reassigned. It wasnt just a witch hunt. We have to focus more on guys who are better academically so we know they will make it in. Having players who are smart and atheletic is the goal here. Look at the last few guys we got verbals from for 2010. Recruited by Vandy,Duke, and other good academic schools. It is tough to know who will make it academically once they get into college and are playing football as well as studying, but you can take a lot of the guess work out if you are bringing in guy you know will qualify.

[Bullpride08]

'Pride..... we both know that Michigan is MICHIGAN. That is a bad comparison.

Cyber what does this mean?  Michigan is Michigan, and that makes it all the more suprising that Martavious Odom made it in there but was told no here.....If he falls out of school the fans of Michigan don't blame anyone but the player for not having the sense to stick with it when they're given every advantage, and opportunity in the world to stay eligible.  If it becomes habitual then it's on the coach....

What is the difference from UM to USF in this case?  We're lesser of an academic institution, and the admission of Odom for us would have been just as big of an exception as it was for UM admissions.  Seems at some schools, with strong academic reputations, are far less sensitive to the issue some of you are discussing.  UM, and OSU fans don't care....they want to win, and they're ranked well ahead of USF.

[BDYZR]

In my world, when you don't follow certain guidlines set out by the folks that sign your paycheck they tend to get a little upset with you.

I'm guessing that in CJL's world he was told what he could or could not do with certain recruits.

I'm guessing, since this commitee is new, they kind a pissed him off.

I'm guessing this same commitee answers to the same people CJL does and are doing what they think is best. For their jobs and USF.

Now, if CJL can't win under the guidelines set up, THEN he should be fired.

[Bullpride08]

Bp08, no one is asking for 1400 SAT. And as far as Joyer was concerned, they found out that on several occasions his grades were incorrect and had to be changed back to lower one. Also, the principal for his school was reassigned. It wasnt just a witch hunt. We have to focus more on guys who are better academically so we know they will make it in. Having players who are smart and atheletic is the goal here. Look at the last few guys we got verbals from for 2010. Recruited by Vandy,Duke, and other good academic schools. It is tough to know who will make it academically once they get into college and are playing football as well as studying, but you can take a lot of the guess work out if you are bringing in guy you know will qualify.

"SEVERAL"  again boys stop re-writing history Joyer had one grade that was incorrectly printed and had to be changed back.  It didn't make a big difference, and if you knew the facts that if the Joyers had waited for this 'committee' to reconvene he probably would have made it in.  The joke is you're arguing that this kid didn't deserve to make it in, when USF wanted to admit him, and would have admitted him, if he and his dad and been patient and waited for the committee to reconvene like two other classmates who were awaiting their fate this week.  Mr. Joyer wanted an answer immediately, which Leavitt couldn't HONESTLY GIVE.  

SO why spin further.  Had the Joyers not been knee-jerked themselves, and been patient there was about a 95% chance he was going to be admitted this week.  They didn't, and they made it public, and thus sealed his fate.  BTW, the principal who was reassigned was done so by request, he had been at Wesley Chapel since it opened, and he and others in Pasco were livid with the article and the challenges from USF.  Even after the NCAA said they were still fine with it.

Also, Leavitt has signed plenty of his share of guys in academic good standing.  Kinds like Griffin, and huners were exceptional high school students.  But even those kids slip up, Huners was declared academically ineligible for the bowl game.....we're not signing a better class of citizen here, you act like the verbal of a kicker, and Wilkinson is turning us into Wake Forest.  I won't make this an ordeal, but in that very same class we're sure to add at least 3-4 JUCO guys, and possibly one special prep school kid.   It always balances itself out.

[Bullpride08]

In my world, when you don't follow certain guidlines set out by the folks that sign your paycheck they tend to get a little upset with you.

I'm guessing that in CJL's world he was told what he could or could not do with certain recruits.

I'm guessing, since this commitee is new, they kind a pissed him off.

I'm guessing this same commitee answers to the same people CJL does and are doing what they think is best. For their jobs and USF.

Now, if CJL can't win under the guidelines set up, THEN he should be fired.

Agreed, I just personally believe that every time i see a school mix the academics with the athletics things get turned upside down.  What you are suggesting can be handled by laying additional contractual obligations to the coach, and if he doesn't perform then he's fired.  I am just not one for adding layers to watch after someone not doing their job....you simply reprimand, and eventually fire them if they can't rectify.  Adding layers is always difficult to stop doing, and it always ends up being more than is necessary if you have the right people on the job in the first place.    I give Leavitt a mulligan because where we came from, but whatever his guidelines are by the 'people who write his check' he needs to work with them.  Period.

[2000bull]

Aren't you screwing the next coach if you have to fire your current coach for losing scholarships? Besides, I thought w/ joyer they said there was AT LEAST ONE inaccurate grade change of the nine, meaning there could be more?

[SANJAY]

What percentage of BCS football players would make it into their current schools without football?  My guess is that it is a pretty low percentage.  Yes the kids playing football at stanford/Vanderbilt/duke are smart, but the vast majority have no chance at those schools without football.  The vast majority of football players at state schools in florida could not have gotten into those schools without football.  This is not just a Joyer or Thornton issue either, I think if you looked at the transcripts of the kids coming into every football program in the state you would see some horrific grades and test scores.

All football players are being held against a different standard, and for most programs that is only the NCAA minimums.