This could be the end of the Big East

[Danm1983]

The basketball schools think separating themselves from the others is going to help them, but it's only going to hurt them as far as TV money goes. Perhaps G'Town and Nova get picked up by the ACC as non-football/everything else members....though I can't see the ACC really going that route unless they're really desperate to gain back the DC/Philly markets they lost from Maryland leaving.

I do know if the BE schools split, MSG will renegotiate and may even end the deal and give the ACC their tournament in MSG. Esp if Georgetown and Villanova come on board - combine that with Syracuse, Pitt, Notre Dame, and Louisville from the BE, as well as names like Duke and UNC, and fans from the Carolinas and BC don't have to go too far - and there you go.

[TallyBull]

We might be talking past one another.

It is my contention that the conference - currently referred to as the Big East - is in fact CUSA-II. When we speak of 'going back to CUSA or the Sun Belt', we are, in my opinion already there, by virtue of removing the BCS moniker, we just haven't changed the logo. I don't care if the FBS conference is called the 'Big East', the 'Pan American', or 'The Next Best Thing', Once you peel off the wrapper, FBS wise, it is CUSA!

Now, am I to understand that we are so cash-strapped that losing the hoops-only schools would be a severe blow? Are they really the 'jewels' of this conference? Why would the conference - whatever name you give it - collapse, or even become more devalued, if the small basketball schools were to leave?

Oh, now I see what you mean. Yes, I agree we're already C-USA 2.0. While it's not ideal, it's what we're left with (reality). So my only point is let's make the best of a bad situation. And I think we can agree that trying to hold on to basketball-only schools that don't want to associate with the Big East is a losing proposition, and we may all be better off parting ways, even if it means a little less money (at this point our payday is already going to suck; might as well suck a little more but position the conference for long-term success).

[Danm1983]

We might be talking past one another.

It is my contention that the conference - currently referred to as the Big East - is in fact CUSA-II. When we speak of 'going back to CUSA or the Sun Belt', we are, in my opinion already there, by virtue of removing the BCS moniker, we just haven't changed the logo. I don't care if the FBS conference is called the 'Big East', the 'Pan American', or 'The Next Best Thing', Once you peel off the wrapper, FBS wise, it is CUSA! And I would suspect that the media would be inclined to ink a deal that reflects our current position.

Now, am I to understand that we are so cash-strapped that losing the hoops-only schools would be a severe blow? Are they really the 'jewels' of this conference? Why would the conference - whatever name you give it - collapse, or even become more devalued, if the small basketball schools were to leave?

It wouldn't...at least not that much. That's what I think some people don't see clearly. Disregarding overall history as that has not been a factor in realignment due to what have you done for me lately stances, the BE has already lost most of its recent power teams: WVU, Pitt, Syracuse, Louisville, Notre Dame. That's a solid core of teams that hang out in the Top 25 to some extent. The others would be Cincinnati, Marquette, Villanova, Georgetown, UConn. USF has been an up and down team in the last few years. Rutgers, Seton Hall, DePaul, Providence, and St. John's have been nonfactors for the most part. And Rutgers got out of this mess somehow.

Losing Villanova and Georgetown essentially drops most of the marquis names from the BE. St. John's and Seton Hall have had some past success, but the rest of us not named UConn aren't really lighting up the interest meter. Cincinnati and Marquette get some run, but even when they're good kinda get that "leftover/halfass" interest because they're not the traditional BE team.

[Danm1983]

We might be talking past one another.

It is my contention that the conference - currently referred to as the Big East - is in fact CUSA-II. When we speak of 'going back to CUSA or the Sun Belt', we are, in my opinion already there, by virtue of removing the BCS moniker, we just haven't changed the logo. I don't care if the FBS conference is called the 'Big East', the 'Pan American', or 'The Next Best Thing', Once you peel off the wrapper, FBS wise, it is CUSA!

Now, am I to understand that we are so cash-strapped that losing the hoops-only schools would be a severe blow? Are they really the 'jewels' of this conference? Why would the conference - whatever name you give it - collapse, or even become more devalued, if the small basketball schools were to leave?

Oh, now I see what you mean. Yes, I agree we're already C-USA 2.0. While it's not ideal, it's what we're left with (reality). So my only point is let's make the best of a bad situation. And I think we can agree that trying to hold on to basketball-only schools that don't want to associate with the Big East is a losing proposition, and we may all be better off parting ways, even if it means a little less money (at this point our payday is already going to suck; might as well suck a little more but position the conference for long-term success).

One has to wonder if the Big East basketball schools would rather have chosen to move Villanova up to FBS level football versus bringing in a perennially bad Tulane program.

[WoolyBully]

Awrite. Just wanted to see if I got the joke or not. We're on the same page about this.

Bad Tulane program...well, just being selfish, if we can get some games with them this time around (we didn't in CUSA),

that could be a pretty good road trip. As for what else they bring to the table, just bring some Andouille sausage with

Red Beans and Rice and we'll get along just fine.

[dos equis]

Hopefully when the BE is finally toast, we can do something about our logo. Good lord, it's embarrasing wearing that italicized, high-school-softball-looking **** around.

[inTransit]

We might be talking past one another.

It is my contention that the conference - currently referred to as the Big East - is in fact CUSA-II. When we speak of 'going back to CUSA or the Sun Belt', we are, in my opinion already there, by virtue of removing the BCS moniker, we just haven't changed the logo. I don't care if the FBS conference is called the 'Big East', the 'Pan American', or 'The Next Best Thing', Once you peel off the wrapper, FBS wise, it is CUSA! And I would suspect that the media would be inclined to ink a deal that reflects our current position.

Now, am I to understand that we are so cash-strapped that losing the hoops-only schools would be a severe blow? Are they really the 'jewels' of this conference? Why would the conference - whatever name you give it - collapse, or even become more devalued, if the small basketball schools were to leave?

Big East basketball is a premium product. Much like the SEC resides in the most talent rich bed of athletes of its sport, the NY/NJ/Philly urban area is the most talent rich and concentrated pool of basketball players. While losing that you might say, 'its only basketball', it gives this conference an identity and warrants its due respect. Lose that and you can stop separating out the SB, CUSA and BE because they are all the same. Any benefits UCONN, Cincy and USF may have had from their success in the old big east will slowly be eroded due to the level of competition. UCONN basketball may stay strong but remember they have only been relevant in BB for 20 years.

There is no way to rationalize its good for USF athletics to stop playing against the highest levels of competition in non-football sports.

[Economics_Nerd82]

So, how would this be a bad thing, 'cause I'm just not seeing it?

TV dollars. We don't have big TV dollars now. If we get stuck going back to C-USA or Sun Belt we'd go from $5-10mil per year to about $1-2mil per year. Independent would be worse. Try paying even Willie Taggart and anything resembling a decent staff on that.

Just speculation but I very much doubt we'd ever officially go back to C-USA or Sun Belt. We're far more likely to keep the Big East name in a reformulated/restructured conference consisting of full membership or football only schools, including some or all of our recent additions..

I'm not sure this is true. If western schools return to MWC, the BE is dead without basketball schools.

What do you mean by "dead"? If you're suggesting that the remaining schools couldn't retain the Big East name and continue with a "coalition of the willing," I don't consider that "dead." I only consider the Big East "dead" if the remaining schools have no other choice but to remain independent or join a smaller conference. But so long as you've got eight members, you've got a conference, right? Why would any of the following schools HAVE to go back to a smaller conference, instead of just continuing an association with each other? (I'm honestly asking the question - there may be an answer that I just don't know):

Connecticut

Cincinnati

Temple

South Florida

Central Florida

SMU

Houston

Memphis

Tulane

ECU

Thinking out loud: You have to think, at some point, these eastern defections (even basketball only schools) would encourage dropping the western weight and focusing on a core of eastern schools. If San Diego doesn't add enough to the overall pot, maybe dropping them makes up for the per school loss in basketball TV money.

[bullcocky101]

Basketball was all the BE had left. Under the current format, it will be the best or second best basketball league. If the roundball members leave, we will lose the D.C., New York, and Chicago markets and have nothing of value to market that CUSA didn't have. Anybody seriously think this is good for a school trying to build its image as a national player?

[smazza]

they should have gone along time ago

big east was dying years ago