Wow! Matt Simms, son of Phil, brother of Chris...

[Joe]

why the huge difference in sat scores fron 2005 to 2006?

They're geniuses!

No the SAT moved to a scale of 2400 (that might be wrong) from 1600

[Bullpride08]

fair enough about rose and i don't fault the staff for recruiting him, recruiting is the lifeblood of the program. but we have been burned trying to get a big name player while neglecting a more plausible recruit, getting burned by cornelius ingram at the last minute hurt more because we couldn't get a capable plan b qb, even though guys like dt mcdowell showed interest in our program. do i think it will happen this year, no, but since there is no college football on tv it is fun to speculate.

I don't look at it like that- like we're burned.  In these recruiting prospects there is a winner and loser in everything, all the big schools win some and lose some.   It's all about relationships.  When a coach visits a HS to talk to the coaches about prospects those HC's take them to see and talk to the kids they think best fit their program.  When word gets around USF is in the final two for the #1 OT prospect in FL coaches take notice.  When Leslie Stirrups signs with USF, even if he doesn't get eligible, it's a sign of the type of program we are and who we're looking at and are capable of landing.  If you walk on a HS campus and are content looking at that coaches second tier athletes then you've limited yourself.  

I am not saying go through the top 100 in the nation and in FL and just going after the cream-of-the-crop.  Obviously Leavitt doesn't do that, but he does look at a select few, some that have at least some mutual interest who could help us immediately at certain positions and where it would make sense practically speaking for them to consider USF and goes after them.  That's always been his decision on how to determine which big namers to pursue.   Look at last year, Daron Rose, Fayson, hell how about Javarris James.  You've got to go out on a limb a little bit.  We signed Aston Samuels, a solid player, but his HS is loaded this year so there's a practical reason this recruiting year for USF to pursue some of the top guys at Glade Central.

Lastly, don't be surprised if some big things start to fall.  I will say last year signing Glover, Joseph, Mitchell, and Samuels were big breaks...we swatted off some awfully good schools to get those guys.  More will land our way, patience, and a bit more success on the field, in attendance, and facilities and even more will come flocking.

[Bullpride08]

also sbien i don't respond to many of your posts but i read a lot of them because they are insightful and you know what you are talking about. but even you have to admit you overestimate our chances of landing some of these players, there's a whole slew of a-list prospects that you would pump up as being legitamite gets or heavy usf leans only to see us not get them, ingram, schaeffer, james, rose, bryant miller, darin baldwin, etc. the list goes on and on and i'm sure we'll be adding stephen garcia to that list as well. you're wrong more times than right, so forgive me if i treat your comments with guarded optimism. some of us, like joe, are more realistic and believe we can put some pretty darn good teams recruiting florida and getting a good mix of 3 star players and diamonds in the rough with an occasional 4 star type player. we start having some success like a va tech or k-state and regularly beat bcs teams like unc and kansas this year, than we'll be in a better position to bring in the nationally recruited players like rose or garcia. until than we'll be a fallback option for those type of players which is okay for now considering the newness of our program.

I am a realist myself, and I never predicted those kids would sign, I merely told people of the mutual interest.  Although, I must say Darin Baldwin shocks me since he committed to us on his visit, but that's recruiting.  

I am confused by your comments....you say it's ok to be a fall-back option for now, which I agree, but yet you feel we need to land the occasional four star athlete.  You know how tough it is to land those guys?  Even as a fallback option?  Few four star, or even elite three stars, need a 'fall back' option.  They've got plenty of legit options at their finger tips the idea is as I mentioned earlier for Leavitt to find the big time talent that are calculated risks on his part.  Meaning worth the time and effort to pursue.  Like Stirrups, if we didn't sign him someone else would have despite his academic struggles, and that team would have placed him in Prep School or JC and we would have never been in the picture.    To be a 'fall back' option you first must put yourself in play.  So it's worthwhile to take a calculated jump.

Using your theory that since we didn't sign those other big name guys then USF should have never pursued Stirrups, Peyton, Andre Hall, Carlton Hill, Taurus Johnson, Mompremier, and Cedric Hill.  Sure our percentages aren't as great as say UF to land top tier talent but if we didn't try then think of the guys we WOULDN'T HAVE LANDED.  

Not to mention think of the transfers- Kawika Mitchell, Denson, Haliburton, Amarri Jackson, Amp Hill, Jeremy Burnett, Julian Riley, and many others that would have never transfered back to USF if it not for the fact we had originally pursued them during the recruiting process.

It's all a game.

[bullzpen4636]

I don't look at it like that- like we're burned.  In these recruiting prospects there is a winner and loser in everything, all the big schools win some and lose some.   It's all about relationships.  When a coach visits a HS to talk to the coaches about prospects those HC's take them to see and talk to the kids they think best fit their program.  When word gets around USF is in the final two for the #1 OT prospect in FL coaches take notice.  When Leslie Stirrups signs with USF, even if he doesn't get eligible, it's a sign of the type of program we are and who we're looking at and are capable of landing.  If you walk on a HS campus and are content looking at that coaches second tier athletes then you've limited yourself.  

I am not saying go through the top 100 in the nation and in FL and just going after the cream-of-the-crop.  Obviously Leavitt doesn't do that, but he does look at a select few, some that have at least some mutual interest who could help us immediately at certain positions and where it would make sense practically speaking for them to consider USF and goes after them.  That's always been his decision on how to determine which big namers to pursue.   Look at last year, Daron Rose, Fayson, hell how about Javarris James.  You've got to go out on a limb a little bit.  We signed Aston Samuels, a solid player, but his HS is loaded this year so there's a practical reason this recruiting year for USF to pursue some of the top guys at Glade Central.

Lastly, don't be surprised if some big things start to fall.  I will say last year signing Glover, Joseph, Mitchell, and Samuels were big breaks...we swatted off some awfully good schools to get those guys.  More will land our way, patience, and a bit more success on the field, in attendance, and facilities and even more will come flocking.

i completely agree, as i said similar things on my last post. and i also get annoyed at some of the fans who feel usf should be getting the stephen garcias of this world automatically and don't understand the process and how young this program is. james would have been a bull if not for the miami peer pressure, but as ingram proved that's a tough obstacle to overcome.

[MavTechKNIGHT2]

When Leslie Stirrups signs with USF, even if he doesn't get eligible, it's a sign of the type of program we are and who we're looking at and are capable of landing.

Can you explain this?

You do realize most other programs backed off of him, right?  That is because most other programs can replace him easily with someone of the exact ability.

Not the case for UCF and USF.  I am not sure how you getting even a 5 star kid that is on the verge of disqualifying will give any indication of the type of program you have.

[bullzpen4636]

I am a realist myself, and I never predicted those kids would sign, I merely told people of the mutual interest.  Although, I must say Darin Baldwin shocks me since he committed to us on his visit, but that's recruiting.  

I am confused by your comments....you say it's ok to be a fall-back option for now, which I agree, but yet you feel we need to land the occasional four star athlete.  You know how tough it is to land those guys?  Even as a fallback option?  Few four star, or even elite three stars, need a 'fall back' option.  They've got plenty of legit options at their finger tips the idea is as I mentioned earlier for Leavitt to find the big time talent that are calculated risks on his part.  Meaning worth the time and effort to pursue.  Like Stirrups, if we didn't sign him someone else would have despite his academic struggles, and that team would have placed him in Prep School or JC and we would have never been in the picture.    To be a 'fall back' option you first must put yourself in play.  So it's worthwhile to take a calculated jump.

Using your theory that since we didn't sign those other big name guys then USF should have never pursued Stirrups, Peyton, Andre Hall, Carlton Hill, Taurus Johnson, Mompremier, and Cedric Hill.  Sure our percentages aren't as great as say UF to land top tier talent but if we didn't try then think of the guys we WOULDN'T HAVE LANDED.  

Not to mention think of the transfers- Kawika Mitchell, Denson, Haliburton, Amarri Jackson, Amp Hill, Jeremy Burnett, Julian Riley, and many others that would have never transfered back to USF if it not for the fact we had originally pursued them during the recruiting process.

It's all a game.

let me just clarify and yes it is all a game and you do win some or lose some, however it's fun to follow and is incredibly important to any program. we are a fall back option to the big 3 and national programs, mompremier was a 4 star caliber player as was peyton, however a major reason we had a shot at those players is because the big 3 didn't show them much love, mompremier was thought of as a safety/lb tweener and peyton had some character issues (which were proven to be true). taurus johnson was a gator all the way until they stopped recruiting him. if we really want a prospect and a program like the big 3 or ut, etc also really want him with everything being equal we will lose 98 percent of the time. it doesn't mean we shouldn't pursue them, because things can happen, like you stated, they can sign someone else that is higher rated and lose interest in that prospect. unfortunately most of the time that will be how we get most 4 star prospects until we start maturing as a program, which i believe we will.

rose however was a different case he had absolutely no weakness and his fall back option was uf, miami, or southern cal if florida state didn't want him. that why i thought it was a bit futile, however if he approached us like you stated than of course i don't fault the staff for recruiting him. he's from tampa so we had something on our side.

[bullzpen4636]

Can you explain this?

You do realize most other programs backed off of him, right?  That is because most other programs can replace him easily with someone of the exact ability.

Not the case for UCF and USF.  I am not sure how you getting even a 5 star kid that is on the verge of disqualifying will give any indication of the type of program you have.

are you insinuating that o'liar would not listen to a player of stirrups caliber if he showed some interest? he was probably the third best prospect from the tampa area last year, he was being recruited on a national level by teams like southern cal before grades became a problem. if there is even a slight chance you could get him on the field, you make that gamble. especially for a program like usf and absolutely for a non bcs program like ucf. he'd have been the most highly rated recruit ucf ever got besides culpepper. and after seeing your d-line get demolished by our o-line last year you seriously could use the help.

[Triple B]

Can you explain this?

You do realize most other programs backed off of him, right?  That is because most other programs can replace him easily with someone of the exact ability.

Not the case for UCF and USF.  I am not sure how you getting even a 5 star kid that is on the verge of disqualifying will give any indication of the type of program you have.

STK will be proud .......

[SRQ]

 

Not to mention think of the transfers- Kawika Mitchell, Denson, Haliburton, Amarri Jackson, Amp Hill, Jeremy Burnett, Julian Riley, and many others that would have never transfered back to USF if it not for the fact we had originally pursued them during the recruiting process.

This is the #1 reason to pursue these guys and build a relationship.  Many of these kids have never been out of the 'hood much less the state and some of them are going to get homesick.

For the next decade, we will be their best option to come 'home' and still play BCS-ball.

These are the kind of players that are going to create the BIG 4.

[Bullpride08]

STK will be proud .......

Wouldn't he be!  Never mind the fact we had to sweat out trips by him to Ole Miss, and Miami...with over a half-dozen offers that were outstanding.