Who do these guys belong to??

[Jewbull]

Its only Skips 2nd yr, isn't he still playing with Leavitt's kids, how many guys on the squad that play are part of Skips recruiting class, you cant totally blame guy when he has someone else's players out there.

Brian Kelly made that point last week, and the media ripped him for it, but it is true. Brady Hoke at Michigan is winning with Rich Rod's guys, Rich Rod time and time again said he needed one more year, Michigan didn't have the patience for it, we aren't Michigan, lets see what this guy can do with his own guys before calling for his head.

[usfgrad84]

Its only Skips 2nd yr, isn't he still playing with Leavitt's kids, how many guys on the squad that play are part of Skips recruiting class, you cant totally blame guy when he has someone else's players out there.

Brian Kelly made that point last week, and the media ripped him for it, but it is true. Brady Hoke at Michigan is winning with Rich Rod's guys, Rich Rod time and time again said he needed one more year, Michigan didn't have the patience for it, we aren't Michigan, lets see what this guy can do with his own guys before calling for his head.

That's a silly statement. UL and Cincy both have 2nd year coaches and are leading the league. UCONN, Pitt and WVU have first year coaches and still have a possibility to win the league. Skip is not getting fired, but its not too much to ask for a team to at least win a couple of conference games.

Notre Dame and Michigan's expectations are to be competing for National Championships. That's difficult to do with someone else's players. Winning a few conference games and being bowl eligible rather going 0-7 in conference while setting new program losing streaks is a different story all together.

[Jewbull]

Maybe Pitt & Cincy's previous regime left better talent than our previous regime, point is, you cant control who was left for you to play with

[snarling Bull]

Its only Skips 2nd yr, isn't he still playing with Leavitt's kids, how many guys on the squad that play are part of Skips recruiting class, you cant totally blame guy when he has someone else's players out there.

Brian Kelly made that point last week, and the media ripped him for it, but it is true. Brady Hoke at Michigan is winning with Rich Rod's guys, Rich Rod time and time again said he needed one more year, Michigan didn't have the patience for it, we aren't Michigan, lets see what this guy can do with his own guys before calling for his head.

That's a silly statement. UL and Cincy both have 2nd year coaches and are leading the league. UCONN, Pitt and WVU have first year coaches and still have a possibility to win the league. Skip is not getting fired, but its not too much to ask for a team to at least win a couple of conference games.

Notre Dame and Michigan's expectations are to be competing for National Championships. That's difficult to do with someone else's players. Winning a few conference games and being bowl eligible rather going 0-7 in conference while setting new program losing streaks is a different story all together.

I agree fully. How many people on this board said that we were going to win the conference last year, then this year? Now it's because they are Leavitt's players. Wow we can make excuses like Skippy.

[TrujilloBull2013]

a few things to consider:

1. Pitt consistently had highly rated recruiting classes. they've been reloading year after year with BCS-caliber players. we haven't. Pitt's problems were coaching ineptitude. at 4-5 overall and 2-2 in conference, they aren't exactly world-beaters now either, and the best they can hope for is a 7-5 season, which would essentially be a push from last year's 8-5, 5-2 campaign with Wannstache. Pitt's new coach (don't even know his name) is doing in his first year what Skip did in his first year: hold the status quo. this is the year Skip seems to be trying to transition to his own style of play, and the growing pains are obvious.

2. both Cinci and UL have had recent BCS bowl wins/conference titles. their recruiting has boosted from that. their growing pains under Strong and Jones occurred the first year. now they are hitting their stride. while Cinci is clearly a strong squad, Louisville's 5-4 overall record isn't spectacular.

3. u can't just look at new coaches at new programs and compare them tout suite. u must ALSO consider their coaching styles, offensive and defensive schemes and how similar/dissimilar they were from the previous coach. Skip ball under USF is NOT Skip ball under ECU. Skip didn't run a spread at ECU and didn't have the raw athletes he has here at USF. one of the criticisms under Leavitt was the minimal amount of "coaching up" that occurred. Grothe in his Junior season was not vastly improved over Grothe in his Freshman season, for example. guys like McCarney coached up kids like Selvie and it was evident just how good he was after he left. what Holtz has now are raw athletes that not only need to be coached up, but also need to be adapted to Holtz' system as it takes shape.

4. we're a young team. i may be mistaken, but we don't have a single standout skill player on offense who is a senior. AJ Love is not a standout. BJ is a Jr., Murray and Scott are Jr's, Landi, Shield, Marc and Griffin are Jr's, Welch and Davis are freshmen, etc. we have a few seniors on the OL, at least one of whom is a former walk-on, but their backups are overwhelmingly underclassmen.

the defense isn't much different. we don't have a single Sr. starting at LB... Young, Washington and Butler are Sr DBs but they are holdovers from the worst USF secondary of all time from Tressey's year/Leavitt's last year. one Sr. DT with tons of underclassmen backing them up. we have a few Sr. ends, but they have split starts with sophomores like Giddins and Forte. the defense also has the added disadvantage of our worst coach, Dan Snyder, who has put together 3/4 of a good game out of 4 conference matchups, and that was last night's Rutgers game which he gave away to Dodd/Sanu with 2 minutes on the clock. 0.75/4 is a horrible ratio.

i'm not making excuses for Holtz. he belongs on the hotseat and he needs to upgrade his staff ASAP. i'd dump Snyder now if i were him. but to point to Brady Hoke or Charlie Strong or Butch Jones and say "LOOK AT THOSE 2 YEAR COACHES THEY KICK ASS!!" is simply disingenuous. all situations are not equal in college football, and Holtz has unique circumstances that are different than any of those coaches.

[Who'sYourData?]

Its only Skips 2nd yr, isn't he still playing with Leavitt's kids, how many guys on the squad that play are part of Skips recruiting class, you cant totally blame guy when he has someone else's players out there.

Brian Kelly made that point last week, and the media ripped him for it, but it is true. Brady Hoke at Michigan is winning with Rich Rod's guys, Rich Rod time and time again said he needed one more year, Michigan didn't have the patience for it, we aren't Michigan, lets see what this guy can do with his own guys before calling for his head.

That's a silly statement. UL and Cincy both have 2nd year coaches and are leading the league. UCONN, Pitt and WVU have first year coaches and still have a possibility to win the league. Skip is not getting fired, but its not too much to ask for a team to at least win a couple of conference games.

Notre Dame and Michigan's expectations are to be competing for National Championships. That's difficult to do with someone else's players. Winning a few conference games and being bowl eligible rather going 0-7 in conference while setting new program losing streaks is a different story all together.

Cincy was dominating the league before Brian Kelly left. Don't you think he left some pretty good talent there?

[DELdaBull]

Its only Skips 2nd yr, isn't he still playing with Leavitt's kids, how many guys on the squad that play are part of Skips recruiting class, you cant totally blame guy when he has someone else's players out there.

Brian Kelly made that point last week, and the media ripped him for it, but it is true. Brady Hoke at Michigan is winning with Rich Rod's guys, Rich Rod time and time again said he needed one more year, Michigan didn't have the patience for it, we aren't Michigan, lets see what this guy can do with his own guys before calling for his head.

That's a silly statement. UL and Cincy both have 2nd year coaches and are leading the league. UCONN, Pitt and WVU have first year coaches and still have a possibility to win the league. Skip is not getting fired, but its not too much to ask for a team to at least win a couple of conference games.

Notre Dame and Michigan's expectations are to be competing for National Championships. That's difficult to do with someone else's players. Winning a few conference games and being bowl eligible rather going 0-7 in conference while setting new program losing streaks is a different story all together.

Cincy was dominating the league before Brian Kelly left. Don't you think he left some pretty good talent there?

Like Collaros and Pead

[Brad]

Cincy is a hard nosed, tough team.

[cmhatter]

Cincy is a hard nosed, tough team.

I have a hard time calling any team that runs a spread offense a "hard nosed, tough team"

[Brad]

I was thinking of the defense. Not in terms of scoring defense either, just hitting.