Marinatto stays quiet, busy amid Big Ten talk

[Bullpride08]

That said, there is no way Georgetown, Villanova, Seton Hall, Providence, St Johns, Marquette, or DePaul would agree to kick Notre Dame out.

DePaul should be more worried about being booted themselves.

Hardly, the Catholic Schools will not crater one another at all.  There is a very simple armistice struck in the BE...there are 8 hoops schools, and 8 football schools...there are 8 Catholic Schools, and there are 8 that are not.  I can't see how much clearer the lines can be drawn for people then that, but it's not coincidentally that the 8 non-football schools are also the 8 Catholic Schools.  Those sides will never give the other an advantage...and it's a pretty defiant position by each group.  Remember of the 8 original BE members five are in that Catholic/non-football bunch Providence, SJ, Gtown, SHall, Nova...the other three are/were Cuse, BC, and Uconn.  The hoops schools own the votes necessary within the group that controls the naming rights, the NCAA units, and all the tie-ins, therefore the football schools like USF are not wise to rock the apple cart.

DePaul getting booted by the BE would possibly cause such a ruckus that the Vatican would get involved.  Not seriously but that's how deeply rooted the feelings and opinions of these groups are grounded.  Furthermore, a big issue with these schools is affiliation with inferior schools.  This is why there is major internal concerns that if more than one BE team is taken by the B10, then instead of adding two or more C-DOA schools those Catholic/Hoops schools will just give the remaining football schools the boot, send us with our NCAA units, and revenue, and the change the BE into something more akin to what it was originally created for, hoops and Olympic Sports...something like a souped up A-10.  That's a real issue because there was a lot of heartburn even when they accepted USF, and USF is ahead rankings wise, and prestige wise then many of the other C-DOA schools being mentioned.  And yes they are that arrogant, and do not want to water down the conference with brethren like ECU, Memphis, and maybe UCF to team up with a member school like USF who they already snub their nose to.

These are the battlefields that fans should know about before making these crazy conference assumptions that the BE would just add 5 teams from C-DOA, and we'd all play together, rent a huge van, paint it all sorts of colors, and drive the countryside with our family band singing songs of being 'happy'.   :-\  It ain't goin down like that folks, guaranteed!

[deathrow95]

  "Hardly, the Catholic Schools will not crater one another at all.  There is a very simple armistice struck in the BE...there are 8 hoops schools, and 8 football schools"

Nicely said.  The conference is set up with an even balance so no one rules the roost.  Now that being said the non-football schools aren't stupid. They won't kick the football schools out because they are some of the best B-ball schools in the conference and  lend a lot creditability to the conference because of football.  There is no way the non-football schools on there own would command the respect and money that the football schools provide. 

[deathrow95]

  While I'm on my rant. Who would you add to the conference that would make it better than it is?  Marinatto would love to add a school that bring in more than it takes.  Adding another school adds another mouth to feed.  As the B10 is evaluating right now that very idea.  There is no slam dunk football playing school out there that will make the Big East better outside ND. University presidents & Boards make the call not AD's.  They will be looking for good sports and high profiles.  AAU membership Tier 1 schools or high Tier 2. Universities are first and foremost institutions of learning they want to associate themselves with other learning elite schools.  Sometimes this gets lost in the conversation. 

  We were lucky while we are Tier 3 be pull down a lot of research money and that put us over the hump so to speck with the Big East.  Any new school must meet this criteria and maybe more.  Now if the Big East losses a school this criteria will change.  My guess is if we do loose a school it will be only one school.  The Big 12 is the conference that has to watch out. It doesn't share its money so it makes makes a lot of sen$e for schools to bail. 

  Marinatto is in a tough spot and the only thing he and any other conference at this point is watch the Big Ten and see what happens.

[Bullpride08]

  While I'm on my rant. Who would you add to the conference that would make it better than it is?   Marinatto would love to add a school that bring in more than it takes.  Adding another school adds another mouth to feed.  As the B10 is evaluating right now that very idea.  There is no slam dunk football playing school out there that will make the Big East better outside ND. University presidents & Boards make the call not AD's.  They will be looking for good sports and high profiles.  AAU membership Tier 1 schools or high Tier 2. Universities are first and foremost institutions of learning they want to associate themselves with other learning elite schools.  Sometimes this gets lost in the conversation. 

   We were lucky while we are Tier 3 be pull down a lot of research money and that put us over the hump so to speck with the Big East.  Any new school must meet this criteria and maybe more.  Now if the Big East losses a school this criteria will change.   My guess is if we do loose a school it will be only one school.  The Big 12 is the conference that has to watch out. It doesn't share its money so it makes makes a lot of sen$e for schools to bail. 

   Marinatto is in a tough spot and the only thing he and any other conference at this point is watch the Big Ten and see what happens.

You are so right, and if say RU was taken there is no easy answer for 1 school to take.  I've been saying in that situation don't be surprised if a darkhorse isn't a school like UofBuffalo.  You may laugh, but if RU goes so goes one of the BE's AAU schools and that was something they were striving for members to join.  Buffalo is an AAU school that has some semi-decent facilities and athletics....Temple will be talked about again too.  Umass is another one that could be a good option.  They've been consistently dominant in football and with Northeastern and Hofstra ending football all of a sudden, Umass not only added a bunch of their good players, but return a good team that should make the playoffs.  This puts Umass in an odd position playing in two conferences CAA for football which is shrinking quickly with the losses of Hofstra and Northeastern, and A-10.  Umass plays at a high level with all their other sports, and they have a high level hockey team which would give the BE 6 hockey teams and an option to form a hockey conference-- money maker.  Umass's old stadium is expandable and they could play in Boston for a year or so while it's expanding...all their other athletic programs are growing, and with some of these northeastern 1-AA programs killing off football Umass needs to be proactive, and they were considered for AAU at one point too.

Those are the type of options I see Presidents of the BE gravitating toward, more than a Memphis, or ECU, and maybe even a UCF.

[BullsFanInTX]

  While I'm on my rant. Who would you add to the conference that would make it better than it is?   Marinatto would love to add a school that bring in more than it takes.  Adding another school adds another mouth to feed.  As the B10 is evaluating right now that very idea.  There is no slam dunk football playing school out there that will make the Big East better outside ND. University presidents & Boards make the call not AD's.  They will be looking for good sports and high profiles.  AAU membership Tier 1 schools or high Tier 2. Universities are first and foremost institutions of learning they want to associate themselves with other learning elite schools.  Sometimes this gets lost in the conversation. 

   We were lucky while we are Tier 3 be pull down a lot of research money and that put us over the hump so to speck with the Big East.  Any new school must meet this criteria and maybe more.  Now if the Big East losses a school this criteria will change.   My guess is if we do loose a school it will be only one school.  The Big 12 is the conference that has to watch out. It doesn't share its money so it makes makes a lot of sen$e for schools to bail. 

   Marinatto is in a tough spot and the only thing he and any other conference at this point is watch the Big Ten and see what happens.

  TCU for starters.  Then think about ECU if necessary.

[BullsFanInTX]

If I were the BE, I would do like the B12 did.  Start talking tough.  Immediately.  It might not scare off the B10, but it might give them pause.  Do like the B12 is thinking about doing and give ultimatums.  To ND if necessary, or to those who are flirting with the B10.  In or out so we can make plans and secure our future.  Then stick to their guns.  B10 just might back off.  What else have u got to lose.  Then vow that whoever is left over and promises to stick it though will remain together no matter what.  That is what I would do if I were Marinatto.  Start talking tough like Tagliabue started to when talking about the B10, keep it up, keep the pressure on, and force people to make decisions.  In or out.   

First, I have not seen any remote talk of Big 12 ultimatum.  That would be interesting.  Living in TX, do you have a source you can share (news outlet or similar)?

That said, there is no way Georgetown, Villanova, Seton Hall, Providence, St Johns, Marquette, or DePaul would agree to kick Notre Dame out.  U Conn, Syracuse and Pittsburgh would likely side with them as well. The best you can hope for there is what has already taken place -- the "trial balloon" that was floated by the football coaches that fell flat.  Notre Dame knows the Big East Conference does not have the backbone to back up such a threat.

However, any action like you prescribe would have to come from the university presidents, not the conference commissioner.  From what I've seen, Beebe hasn't said much publicly about the Big 12 - but the university presidents have (I saw something from OU's president).  University presidents are politicians, they won't do anything that doesn't allow them to keep their options open.

The actions you suggest simply back the Big East into a corner and dare teams to call their bluff.  That isn't being proactive, that's being defiant.

And it can backfire in a big, big way.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20100523/COLUMNIST0202/5230347/1108

When the phone call came from Big 12 headquarters, I pictured tumbleweeds blowing through an office building in suburban Dallas.

Haven't you heard? The Big 12 is turning into a ghost town. The Big Ten is in the process of poaching a couple of its key members. The SEC is preparing a raid. The Pac-10 wants to cherry-pick a program or two.

Would the last school to leave the Big 12 please turn off the lights?

But to quote noted college football philosopher Lee Corso: Not so fast, my friend.

"I understand there are those in our conference that may want to look at other options out there," said Dan Beebe, commissioner of the Big 12. "At the end of the day, those schools would have to consider what they would be leaving this conference for.

"I think they're going to find that what we provide has benefited our members and will continue to benefit our members."

Beebe has been around the block a time or two. As an NCAA investigator, he did the gumshoe work that resulted in the death penalty for SMU in 1987. He was commissioner of the Ohio Valley Conference from 1989 to 2003. He's been with the Big 12 ever since, including the past two-plus years as commissioner.

Yes, he's fully aware of the expansionist mind-set of the Big Ten, which coincidentally is commanded by another ex-OVC commissioner, Jim Delany.

The Big Ten supposedly has its eyes on Missouri and Nebraska, the former for all those TV sets in St. Louis, the latter for the Cornhuskers' football pedigree.

If the dominoes start to fall, SEC Commissioner Mike Slive has made it clear his conference will do whatever it must do to keep up with the Joneses.

Texas and Texas A&M figure to be in the SEC's crosshairs.

But those who expect Beebe to give up without a fight don't know him very well. His next order of business is to set a date where Big 12 members must declare if they're in or out.

"We all need to be responsible for what could happen to the entire intercollegiate athletics community," he said. "Sure, we're all looking out for ourselves. But if we're not careful, we can do things that damage everyone."

With that in mind, I'm starting to wonder if the Big Ten's expected power/money grab isn't much ado about very little. Yes, I can see Missouri making the move. Likewise, Big East member Rutgers would jump at the chance to join the Big Ten.

But Notre Dame won't.

Beyond that, anybody expecting a seismic shift in the way intercollegiate sports does business could be sorely disappointed. The vast majority of schools will stay put.

And they should. The concept of mega-conferences ignores one basic tenet of college sports — keep it local, or at least regional. A larger footprint means fewer rivalries. And that will kill a conference.

"Fans want their teams to play against people they know, in their own region," Beebe said. "If you get too far away from that, you're going to struggle."

Smart man.

[Guest]

  While I'm on my rant. Who would you add to the conference that would make it better than it is?   Marinatto would love to add a school that bring in more than it takes.  Adding another school adds another mouth to feed.  As the B10 is evaluating right now that very idea.  There is no slam dunk football playing school out there that will make the Big East better outside ND. University presidents & Boards make the call not AD's.  They will be looking for good sports and high profiles.  AAU membership Tier 1 schools or high Tier 2. Universities are first and foremost institutions of learning they want to associate themselves with other learning elite schools.  Sometimes this gets lost in the conversation. 

   We were lucky while we are Tier 3 be pull down a lot of research money and that put us over the hump so to speck with the Big East.  Any new school must meet this criteria and maybe more.  Now if the Big East losses a school this criteria will change.   My guess is if we do loose a school it will be only one school.  The Big 12 is the conference that has to watch out. It doesn't share its money so it makes makes a lot of sen$e for schools to bail. 

   Marinatto is in a tough spot and the only thing he and any other conference at this point is watch the Big Ten and see what happens.

  TCU for starters.  Then think about ECU if necessary.

TCU will join the Big 12 before it joins the Big East.

[Guest]

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20100523/COLUMNIST0202/5230347/1108

But those who expect Beebe to give up without a fight don't know him very well. His next order of business is to set a date where Big 12 members must declare if they're in or out.

After my post, I saw a similar statement saying he wants to ask the Big 12 presidents to set a date and impose a substantial financial penalty for leaving.

It's not a bad idea... especially when you couple that with what I've read from the Big Ten that some people (Wisconsin AD Alvarez) think new members should "buy their way in" by taking a smaller share for a few years.

[BullsFanInTX]

  While I'm on my rant. Who would you add to the conference that would make it better than it is?   Marinatto would love to add a school that bring in more than it takes.  Adding another school adds another mouth to feed.  As the B10 is evaluating right now that very idea.  There is no slam dunk football playing school out there that will make the Big East better outside ND. University presidents & Boards make the call not AD's.  They will be looking for good sports and high profiles.  AAU membership Tier 1 schools or high Tier 2. Universities are first and foremost institutions of learning they want to associate themselves with other learning elite schools.  Sometimes this gets lost in the conversation. 

   We were lucky while we are Tier 3 be pull down a lot of research money and that put us over the hump so to speck with the Big East.  Any new school must meet this criteria and maybe more.  Now if the Big East losses a school this criteria will change.   My guess is if we do loose a school it will be only one school.  The Big 12 is the conference that has to watch out. It doesn't share its money so it makes makes a lot of sen$e for schools to bail. 

   Marinatto is in a tough spot and the only thing he and any other conference at this point is watch the Big Ten and see what happens.

  TCU for starters.  Then think about ECU if necessary.

TCU will join the Big 12 before it joins the Big East.

  TCU will not join tHe B12, the B12 already has that market covered and I don't see Big Brothers UT and A&M going for it.

[Bullpride08]

ok then they'll add Utah, BYU, or Colorado State...all quality possibilities.

Again the B12 is at a far weaker position then the BE.  TO have suggested the BE 'should do what the B12 has done'...what have they done other then give inequitable splits of the pie inciting less equitable members to want to entertain discussions to depart, and put no substantial financial penalty for departure.

The BE did all that years ago, the B12 isn't on the offensive they're in catch-up mode.  The problem with all those measures, is like any other, at the end of the day the SEC, and B10 can pay more so all those counter-measures end up becoming window dressing when another conference can pay a school $10MM+ more a year in payout for just belonging to that other conference.  Suddenly programs like Missouri become very profitable and prospects change.