To Joel Miller

[E.T.]

Bottom Line: Joel didn't do ANYTHING wrong !

Go BULLS !!!

[WHSCats78]

I think the guy likely has a lot of remorse and regret.

No matter how much we highly educated modern day feminized sporting men want to voice our complete disapproval for a coach putting their hands on a kid, this is a kid that knew the act was wrong and wanted to work it out.  He did not want the outcome he got.  He realizes there was no intent to harm him.  He still wanted to play football for USF and Jim Leavitt.  It spun out of his control and now look.  Again no matter how much we highly educated modern day feminized sporting men believe Jim Leavitt should be fired - Joel Miller did not want that.  His reputation has been soiled and his coach fired.  If he can saddle up and play, I'd be shocked.  It would suck the life out of many people, including me, to be in his position. 

Bulliever, with all due respect, I think your categorization is both incorrect and an immature reaction based upon your blind loyalty to Leavitt.  I played in the day with single-bar face masks and suspension helmets.  We rarely -- maybe one or two days a week -- would get water during practices, because our coaches thought going without water would toughen us up.  Perhaps it did, but it also cut down on mental and physical efficiencies (I am sure you understand the physiological ramifications of dehydration).  From rec leauge through high school (D-1 career cut short by injury), I never played on a losing team.  I played for some coaches who were physically abusive (one set of coaches would hit kids with branches from a nearby patch of woods, would kick kids in butt, etc.), and I played for some coaches who were intelligent enough to motivate and win without resorting to physical abuse.

I have also coached for many, many years, and I have adopted the approach that I will not be physically abusive with my players.  I have never coached a losing team.  I push my players very hard, and demand a lot from them, but I have the intelligence and the ability to get the best out of my players without hitting on kids who wold not be in a position to fight back against it.  Leavitt is not man enough to physically abuse a man like me on the street.  I would have thrased and smashed him into oblivion.  But, "as the most powerful man in the building," he could abuse those under his control.  That is not being a man, that is being a sissy. 

I read all these internet tough guys saying how all of us who don't believe in physical abuse are feminine or wusses or worse.  Well, "tough guys at a keyboard" you are entitled to your opinion.  For any of you who want to put that label on me, however, I hope to be in Florida for a powerlifting meet in February, and if you really think I am a wuss or whatever, pm me and we can arrange to test your theory.

[mikebeau]

another thread taken to full retard level

[Brad]

I think the guy likely has a lot of remorse and regret.

No matter how much we highly educated modern day feminized sporting men want to voice our complete disapproval for a coach putting their hands on a kid, this is a kid that knew the act was wrong and wanted to work it out.  He did not want the outcome he got.  He realizes there was no intent to harm him.  He still wanted to play football for USF and Jim Leavitt.  It spun out of his control and now look.  Again no matter how much we highly educated modern day feminized sporting men believe Jim Leavitt should be fired - Joel Miller did not want that.  His reputation has been soiled and his coach fired.  If he can saddle up and play, I'd be shocked.  It would suck the life out of many people, including me, to be in his position. 

Bulliever, with all due respect, I think your categorization is both incorrect and an immature reaction based upon your blind loyalty to Leavitt.  I played in the day with single-bar face masks and suspension helmets.  We rarely -- maybe one or two days a week -- would get water during practices, because our coaches thought going without water would toughen us up.  Perhaps it did, but it also cut down on mental and physical efficiencies (I am sure you understand the physiological ramifications of dehydration).  From rec leauge through high school (D-1 career cut short by injury), I never played on a losing team.  I played for some coaches who were physically abusive (one set of coaches would hit kids with branches from a nearby patch of woods, would kick kids in butt, etc.), and I played for some coaches who were intelligent enough to motivate and win without resorting to physical abuse.

I have also coached for many, many years, and I have adopted the approach that I will not be physically abusive with my players.  I have never coached a losing team.  I push my players very hard, and demand a lot from them, but I have the intelligence and the ability to get the best out of my players without hitting on kids who wold not be in a position to fight back against it.  Leavitt is not man enough to physically abuse a man like me on the street.  I would have thrased and smashed him into oblivion.  But, "as the most powerful man in the building," he could abuse those under his control.  That is not being a man, that is being a sissy. 

I read all these internet tough guys saying how all of us who don't believe in physical abuse are feminine or wusses or worse.  Well, "tough guys at a keyboard" you are entitled to your opinion.  For any of you who want to put that label on me, however, I hope to be in Florida for a powerlifting meet in February, and if you really think I am a wuss or whatever, pm me and we can arrange to test your theory.

I was typing a response to your post then I re-read it and realized you probably didn't fully read my post or had trouble comprehending it  So with that, I'll pass on the easy retort, invite you to try again, and wish you well intimidating alleged internet tough guys with single bar face mask and powerlifting stories.  Oooohh!!

[slick1ru2]

I think the guy likely has a lot of remorse and regret.

No matter how much we highly educated modern day feminized sporting men want to voice our complete disapproval for a coach putting their hands on a kid, this is a kid that knew the act was wrong and wanted to work it out.  He did not want the outcome he got.  He realizes there was no intent to harm him.  He still wanted to play football for USF and Jim Leavitt.  It spun out of his control and now look.  Again no matter how much we highly educated modern day feminized sporting men believe Jim Leavitt should be fired - Joel Miller did not want that.  His reputation has been soiled and his coach fired.  If he can saddle up and play, I'd be shocked.  It would suck the life out of many people, including me, to be in his position. 

Bulliever, with all due respect, I think your categorization is both incorrect and an immature reaction based upon your blind loyalty to Leavitt.  I played in the day with single-bar face masks and suspension helmets.  We rarely -- maybe one or two days a week -- would get water during practices, because our coaches thought going without water would toughen us up.  Perhaps it did, but it also cut down on mental and physical efficiencies (I am sure you understand the physiological ramifications of dehydration).  From rec leauge through high school (D-1 career cut short by injury), I never played on a losing team.  I played for some coaches who were physically abusive (one set of coaches would hit kids with branches from a nearby patch of woods, would kick kids in butt, etc.), and I played for some coaches who were intelligent enough to motivate and win without resorting to physical abuse.

I have also coached for many, many years, and I have adopted the approach that I will not be physically abusive with my players.  I have never coached a losing team.  I push my players very hard, and demand a lot from them, but I have the intelligence and the ability to get the best out of my players without hitting on kids who wold not be in a position to fight back against it.  Leavitt is not man enough to physically abuse a man like me on the street.  I would have thrased and smashed him into oblivion.  But, "as the most powerful man in the building," he could abuse those under his control.  That is not being a man, that is being a sissy. 

I read all these internet tough guys saying how all of us who don't believe in physical abuse are feminine or wusses or worse.  Well, "tough guys at a keyboard" you are entitled to your opinion.  For any of you who want to put that label on me, however, I hope to be in Florida for a powerlifting meet in February, and if you really think I am a wuss or whatever, pm me and we can arrange to test your theory.

My dad went to Sarasota High, class of '48. That means NO face bar and just leather helmets. He never told me of any coach abuse stories. He was a lineman. He told me of dislocated fingers they had to pull back straight. And he said that the Seminoles (at that time) that were at Arcadia HS were tough. He was dual sport letterman. I am sure they had no water practices, if he were alive I would run it by him. But I doubt anyone got slapped.

[abababa]

Not sure why Bulliever is always trying to defend Leavitt still through all this. This whole place needs to move on.

But Joel Miller will be fine. A new coach isn't going to throw him off the team if he can contribute for this. Clearly in the report a lot of his teammates like him and backed his original story in their interviews.

[hightechbull]

I think the guy likely has a lot of remorse and regret.

No matter how much we highly educated modern day feminized sporting men want to voice our complete disapproval for a coach putting their hands on a kid, this is a kid that knew the act was wrong and wanted to work it out.  He did not want the outcome he got.  He realizes there was no intent to harm him.  He still wanted to play football for USF and Jim Leavitt.  It spun out of his control and now look.  Again no matter how much we highly educated modern day feminized sporting men believe Jim Leavitt should be fired - Joel Miller did not want that.  His reputation has been soiled and his coach fired.  If he can saddle up and play, I'd be shocked.  It would suck the life out of many people, including me, to be in his position. 

Bulliever, with all due respect, I think your categorization is both incorrect and an immature reaction based upon your blind loyalty to Leavitt.  I played in the day with single-bar face masks and suspension helmets.  We rarely -- maybe one or two days a week -- would get water during practices, because our coaches thought going without water would toughen us up.  Perhaps it did, but it also cut down on mental and physical efficiencies (I am sure you understand the physiological ramifications of dehydration).  From rec leauge through high school (D-1 career cut short by injury), I never played on a losing team.  I played for some coaches who were physically abusive (one set of coaches would hit kids with branches from a nearby patch of woods, would kick kids in butt, etc.), and I played for some coaches who were intelligent enough to motivate and win without resorting to physical abuse.

I have also coached for many, many years, and I have adopted the approach that I will not be physically abusive with my players.  I have never coached a losing team.  I push my players very hard, and demand a lot from them, but I have the intelligence and the ability to get the best out of my players without hitting on kids who wold not be in a position to fight back against it.  Leavitt is not man enough to physically abuse a man like me on the street.  I would have thrased and smashed him into oblivion.  But, "as the most powerful man in the building," he could abuse those under his control.  That is not being a man, that is being a sissy. 

I read all these internet tough guys saying how all of us who don't believe in physical abuse are feminine or wusses or worse.  Well, "tough guys at a keyboard" you are entitled to your opinion.  For any of you who want to put that label on me, however, I hope to be in Florida for a powerlifting meet in February, and if you really think I am a wuss or whatever, pm me and we can arrange to test your theory.

To Mr 9 posts:

Wuss.

[WHSCats78]

hitech,

Haven't gotten your pm yet.  I'll be waiting on it.  If you think abusing kids is okay, I doubt I'll have much to worry about.

Been on these boards for years.  Just don't post much.  Never saw where a high post count equated to knowledge or intelligence.  Thanks for proving my point.

The point I was making, which apparently went over your and Bulliver's head, was people claim those of us who think abusing kids is cowardly and wrong are feminizing (he seems to be infatuted with that word) football.  I don't know Bulliever, but I may have been playing football before he was born.  I was playing organized football over 40 years ago.  I don't need someone who didn't play the game in that era trying to tell me how the game is changing for the worse because we no longer tolerate bullying of kids who are either too young to fight back or are in a position where speaking up could jeopardize their future. 

As one who has had one child go D-1, another likely to, and coached a bunch who have, you may be surprised how well recruiting will eventually pick up with Leavitt gone. 

[Brad]

Not sure why Bulliever is always trying to defend Leavitt still through all this. This whole place needs to move on.

But Joel Miller will be fine. A new coach isn't going to throw him off the team if he can contribute for this. Clearly in the report a lot of his teammates like him and backed his original story in their interviews.

I'd like you to pull your head out and tell me where I am defending Leavitt.  If this thing went the other way, I'd make the same comments.  But you?  Likely not.  You have the bias regarding Leavitt, not me. 

You take a general statement and misuse it.  You should try journalism.

[BDYZR]

I hope the lessons learned from this are that when you have a problem that you consider your options and the ramifications of your actions. Joel, you DID NOT start this.

IMO the ONLY mistake you made was talking to so many people. Face your problems head-on. I know that you sought advice, only from the wrong sources. Go to your dad first if CJL intimidated you. Then coach Franks, then Canales, and on up the ladder if you were not satisfied.

This is a done deal. We all make mistakes in life. It's the lessons we learn from them that make us better people.

Good Luck.