Adding more conference games

[SoFlaEer]

the lack of conerence games gives usf a disadvantage in schedule OC games.  Schools know we don't have a leg to stand on bargaining wise as far as getting home and homes and what not, because other schools know we have to schedule 5 OC games a year.  Hence the Auburn one game away.

actually - it has more to do with you guys not being an established program that can demand home and home's with the likes of auburn.  and i dont mean this as a slam.  you guys are still the new kids on the block and part of the growing pains will be having to do things like this.

look at florida state's history.  late 70's into the mid 80's they were becoming a dominant force in college football, but they were unable to get a lot of big name schools to come to tallahassee and typically only had 5 home games a year, so bowden took the show on the road and played whoever he could schedule.  they played lsu 4 straight years, all in baton rouge, 4 games all away versus nebraska, ohio state 2 years in a row on the road, 2 at michigan, 2 at notre dame, none of these schools had return trips to tallahassee in the same time period.

fsu had been around 30 yrs at this point and was becoming one of the most dominant programs in the nation and still had to play on the road

it more has to do with where you are in your team's history, not so much that other schools perceive that you have a scheduling problem and are trying to take advantage of that.

as far as more conference games among current members - not at all a good idea - why guarantee a BE member an extra win at the expense of a guaranteed extra loss within the conference - bad idea

[mikebeau]

I guess all of those away games had nothing to do with FSU's lack of a conference schedule.

Independent 1951-1991

[SoFlaEer]

I guess all of those away games had nothing to do with FSU's lack of a conference schedule.

Independent 1951-1991

they were a football independent, but virtually all metro conference members (memphis, virginia tech, south carolina, louisville, southern miss, florida state, cincy, tulane) played several of each other every year in football, so they got some stability in schueduling that way.  plus there were many many independent div 1-A programs in those days, the scramble for conference memberships didnt happen until the 90's.  they played away games because they were not an established "brand name" program yet, and if they wanted to play the big boys, it was going to have to be on the big boy's terms.

but you're not seriously saying that playing LSU four years in a row, playing mebraska 4 years in a row, playing ohio state 2 years in a row, etc, as the visiting team is merely due to not being in a conference. 

it had to do with fsu not being a brand name football program with elite status yet.  bobby bowden even said as much back at the time, when being interviewed about the difficulty in getting quality opponents.  they wouldnt come to tallahassee, so fsu agreed to play all away games with these programs.

you gotta look at it historically, in the early 80's fsu was a force to be reckoned with, but it was a recent phenomenon and most of the nation still didnt know who they were.  i grew up in ohio, and believe me, we didnt think fsu was anything but an easy win, we knew nothing about them and expected ohio state to blow them out.  fsu you spanked osu 2 years in row.

[mikebeau]

I guess all of those away games had nothing to do with FSU's lack of a conference schedule.

Independent 1951-1991

they were a football independent, but virtually all metro conference members (memphis, virginia tech, south carolina, louisville, southern miss, florida state, cincy, tulane) played several of each other every year in football, so they got some stability in schueduling that way.

but you're not seriously saying that playing LSU four years in a row, playing mebraska 4 years in a row, playing ohio state 2 years in a row, etc, as the visiting team is merely due to not being in a conference. 

it had to do with fsu not being a brand name football program with elite status yet.  bobby bowden even said as much back at the time, when being interviewed about the difficulty in getting quality opponents.  they wouldnt come to tallahassee, so fsu agreed to play all away games with these programs.

you gotta look at it historically, in the early 80's fsu was a force to be reckoned with, but it was a recent phenomenon and most of the nation still didnt know who they were.  i grew up in ohio, and believe me, we didnt think fsu was anything but an easy win, we knew nothing about them and expected ohio state to blow them out.  fsu you spanked osu 2 years in row.

no i dont think that was the only reason but it had a part.  If another school knows yer up against the wall to fill your schedule they will negotiate good terms.  Just as any other business.

BUt I know full well we have to go to traditional powers on away games to get those games scheduled.  but I also know if we had a 10 team conference with another quality team or two we could worry less about that.  The landscape has changed from those old days.  Win your conference and you are in a BCS bowl.  Go undefeated and you might be in the MNC.

[MikeG]

How hard would it be for us to push one of the basketball only team to-- espcially the newer ones that came in with us-- and switch them with a CUSA squad like Memphis?

Or better yet raid CUSA for two teams and boot Depaul & Marquette to give us two more conference games per year.

Maybe one would be better to give us an equal 4 home and 4 away

But would we really miss a newer non-football member?

THe team we add could be Memphis or (gulp) UCF or possibly (yeck) ECU. Memphis and UCF fit the model of the Big East a little better-- with the whole metro-type school. And if we wrestle Memphis away--we might scoop the Liberty Bowl-- which would be a decent bowl to go to-- with Beale Street partying to ensue

anyway-- just been kicking this around in my head thinking of ways to equalize the schedules while not impacting hoops but not destroying some other team that came along with us too much. I mean Depaul/Marquette can jump into a midwest pretty conference easily since they are just basketball beyond some other sports they are decent at.

what do you think-- or do you have another idea of how to approach this? The whole football only thing kind of turns me off otherwise. I want a full member who is a decent sized/respected university.

[MikeG]

THe Auburn pay day game was the result of our previous ADs schedule philosophy-- sound at the time--- that was meant to get our name out there, get some cash, and help bolster the coffers of our young program.

Since that game was scheduled-- we were members of CUSA and then the BE. We no longer create pay day games---- although there are still two on the books for FLorida (originally 2008/2009-- moved for UF and USF reasons a few times and currently set for 2010/2015).

We have established several home and home deals since then with numerous BCS teams from the Big Ten (Mich State, Indiana), the Big 12 (Kansas), and the ACC (UNC, NCState, and Miami) with more undoubtedly to come. We also made deals with some lesser conferences (the sun belt and CUSA) with UCF (per BE exit agreement) and 3 for ones with FIU and FAU.

While we would entertain a home and home with Auburn-- you are correct that this is not typical for the SEC teams who face a tough enough conference schedule as it is to be doing these types of deals and eating into their very profitable home games (most SEC teams play a full slate of home game besides the mandatory conference away games-- with some exceptions like UT vs Cal). But I could see this working in the future provided we could expand our stadium somewhat to accomodate the Tampa area SEC fans-- similar to what they do for the Superbowl-- bringing the capacity to about 77K buy adding some stand in both end zones party deck areas.

[MikeG]

the lack of conerence games gives usf a disadvantage in schedule OC games.  Schools know we don't have a leg to stand on bargaining wise as far as getting home and homes and what not, because other schools know we have to schedule 5 OC games a year.  Hence the Auburn one game away.

not exactly-- if anything we have more flexibility to engage in OOC games since 5 games are pretty much up to our AD staff to set up. ALSO--- many OOC teams would see a visit to Tampa as a nice recruiting opportunity to our state. There are lots of positives to doing this, it is more a matter of logistics imo. Our recent success might also be a deterent to wanting to schedule us instead of a lesser 1-A team that will help a team get a better record. But for team that are looking to win a NC-- adding USF may become great way to improve the SOS early in the season (provided they beat us I guess).

see my post above but to address this more specifically--- Auburn was scheduled before they expanded the number of games to twelve a year (although there were provisional 12 game years for a while as well).

We have been quie successful obtianing home and home series with other BCS schools since joining the Big East

But I do agree that having a balanced 4 home and 4 away conference games would be better all around. TO do this-- we would have to add one more football member somehow-- either removing a non-football member for a all sports new entry or some football-only invite (or -- and this is highly unlikely-- forcing Notre Dame to join the league as a football member as well).

It will be pretty complicated to do any of this--- but if the Big Ten does some shuffling to add one more team and the Pac Ten also does something like that to get a championship game-- that would be the time to act.

[TyBull]

dont schedulle rutgers anymore

and don't let them bring in "their" refeeres....

[smazza]

usf should keep playing teams like auburn for the $$$$$$$ AND THE OPPORTUNITY

scrap 1aa games

BIG EAST TEAMS SHOULD  ALL PLAY  TOP 20 TEAMS ON THE ROAD TO build conference credibilty

[mikebeau]

the lack of conerence games gives usf a disadvantage in schedule OC games.  Schools know we don't have a leg to stand on bargaining wise as far as getting home and homes and what not, because other schools know we have to schedule 5 OC games a year.  Hence the Auburn one game away.

not exactly-- if anything we have more flexibility to engage in OOC games since 5 games are pretty much up to our AD staff to set up. ALSO--- many OOC teams would see a visit to Tampa as a nice recruiting opportunity to our state. There are lots of positives to doing this, it is more a matter of logistics imo. Our recent success might also be a deterent to wanting to schedule us instead of a lesser 1-A team that will help a team get a better record. But for team that are looking to win a NC-- adding USF may become great way to improve the SOS early in the season (provided they beat us I guess).

see my post above but to address this more specifically--- Auburn was scheduled before they expanded the number of games to twelve a year (although there were provisional 12 game years for a while as well).

We have been quie successful obtianing home and home series with other BCS schools since joining the Big East

But I do agree that having a balanced 4 home and 4 away conference games would be better all around. TO do this-- we would have to add one more football member somehow-- either removing a non-football member for a all sports new entry or some football-only invite (or -- and this is highly unlikely-- forcing Notre Dame to join the league as a football member as well).

It will be pretty complicated to do any of this--- but if the Big Ten does some shuffling to add one more team and the Pac Ten also does something like that to get a championship game-- that would be the time to act.

Penn State doesn't fit in the big ten.  The Big East should steal them away.  There are natural rivalries for Penn State in the Big east.