Thoughts on rivalries...

[JoeB]

You can't force a rivalry.  If it takes 20 years, it takes 20 years.  That doesn't lessen it.

[BullatFSU]

You can't force a rivalry.  If it takes 20 years, it takes 20 years.  That doesn't lessen it.

You're right, you can't force a rivalry. UCF seems like they're trying to do just that.

[Guest]

You can't force a rivalry.  If it takes 20 years, it takes 20 years.  That doesn't lessen it.

You're right, you can't force a rivalry. UCF seems like they're trying to do just that.

No, you can't force a rivalry ... but you can squelch one.  We had a pretty good rivalry building with Southern Miss, until we got the invite to the Big East.  Now we don't play them any more - and it doesn't look like we will.

In this case, one university wants the game to be annual and the other doesn't.  UCF may be trying to force the issue, but USF is squelching it without really seeing where it could go.

The ideal situation would be to agree to another 1-for-1 series starting in 2010 or so... that gives a couple of years to see if there is really a build up to the game again.  If not, then UCF should be like FAU or FIU, in that we schedule them 2 or 3 times each decade.  I could live with that very easily.

[Triple B]

USF and UCF are both competing for the same thing: inclusion in the upper echelon of Florida football.  Both schools want the Big 3 to become the Big 4.  Doesn't that give them something worthwhile for which to compete??

But Jim, which is more important to you, becoming the Big 4th or creating a rivalry with UCF? Could we do both? Absolutely, but WE have all the components to become that 4th without having to play them the way things are set up right now. They can't, realistically, say the same thing, no matter how much they want to deny it. They COULD get to that 4th spot but it will be a heck of a lot harder than the road we have and beating us would be part of their path.

I know you don't think the outcome of this game would have any bearing on that but I do .....

If any of this has already been addressed on this thread and shot down, I apologize for the redundancy.  

[Guest]

USF and UCF are both competing for the same thing: inclusion in the upper echelon of Florida football.  Both schools want the Big 3 to become the Big 4.  Doesn't that give them something worthwhile for which to compete??

But Jim, which is more important to you, becoming the Big 4th or creating a rivalry with UCF? Could we do both? Absolutely, but WE have all the components to become that 4th without having to play them the way things are set up right now. They can't, realistically, say the same thing, no matter how much they want to deny it. They COULD get to that 4th spot but it will be a heck of a lot harder than the road we have and beating us would be part of their path.

I know you don't think the outcome of this game would have any bearing on that but I do .....

If any of this has already been addressed on this thread and shot down, I apologize for the redundancy.  

If I have to choose one, it's becoming one of the Big 4, but I firmly believe we could do both.

There is only one thing that could put USF into the Big 4: winning the Big East and getting to the first BCS bowl.  Losing to UCF could affect which bowl USF goes to, but it won't affect the fact that USF can get to a BCS bowl.  Once we are a proven BCS team, that puts USF into the Big 4...

To me, they are totally seperate issues with one having no bearing on the other.

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That could be part of the reason CJL doesn't want to carry the UCF game forward, because he thinks USF could make it to the BCS in the next four years.  At that point, I think a potential series with UM could be even more likely to happen.

[Triple B]

There is only one thing that could put USF into the Big 4: winning the Big East and getting to the first BCS bowl.

Losing to UCF could affect which bowl USF goes to, but it won't affect the fact that USF can get to a BCS bowl.  Once we are a proven BCS team, that puts USF into the Big 4...

To me, they are totally seperate issues with one having no bearing on the other.

I don't think it's that easy. You're saying if we beat UConn last year and then somehow upset WVU to get to the Sugar Bowl, we're in the Big 4 ...... I don't see it. To be included in the Big 4 one of the criteria has to be beating one of them. If we do that but in that same year lose to UCF, you lose that edge .... IMO.

 

[Guest]

There is only one thing that could put USF into the Big 4: winning the Big East and getting to the first BCS bowl.

Losing to UCF could affect which bowl USF goes to, but it won't affect the fact that USF can get to a BCS bowl.  Once we are a proven BCS team, that puts USF into the Big 4...

To me, they are totally seperate issues with one having no bearing on the other.

I don't think it's that easy. You're saying if we beat UConn last year and then somehow upset WVU to get to the Sugar Bowl, we're in the Big 4 ...... I don't see it. To be included in the Big 4 one of the criteria has to be beating one of them. If we do that but in that same year lose to UCF, you lose that edge .... IMO.

 

I think if USF makes it to the Sugar Bowl last year, then USF would easily be a Top 25 pre-season this year... (after all WVU made it to the Sugar Bowl and was pre-season Top 5).  I don't know if USF beats Miami or Florida while going 3-8 would mean we are in the Big 4.

The Big 3 are the Big 3 because they are perennial top 25 teams.  To get into the Big 4, USF needs to be a Top 25 team - individual wins and losses become less relevant.

[Bull Dozer]

There is only one thing that could put USF into the Big 4: winning the Big East and getting to the first BCS bowl.

Losing to UCF could affect which bowl USF goes to, but it won't affect the fact that USF can get to a BCS bowl.  Once we are a proven BCS team, that puts USF into the Big 4...

To me, they are totally seperate issues with one having no bearing on the other.

I don't think it's that easy. You're saying if we beat UConn last year and then somehow upset WVU to get to the Sugar Bowl, we're in the Big 4 ...... I don't see it. To be included in the Big 4 one of the criteria has to be beating one of them. If we do that but in that same year lose to UCF, you lose that edge .... IMO.

 

I think if USF makes it to the Sugar Bowl last year, then USF would easily be a Top 25 pre-season this year... (after all WVU made it to the Sugar Bowl and was pre-season Top 5).  I don't know if USF beats Miami or Florida while going 3-8 would mean we are in the Big 4.

The Big 3 are the Big 3 because they are perennial top 25 teams.  To get into the Big 4, USF needs to be a Top 25 team - individual wins and losses become less relevant.

Yup the Big 3 is about consistant success not beating each other.  

[Joe]

Lemme just add something. Rivalries don't always have to have this "big" goal that everyone speaks of.

Purdue and IU play for the Old Oaken Bucket...IU has never been good at football really, Purdue has had it's years. It's an intense game however that people take serious (Might be the only game IU fans actually care about in football)

If you want newer rivalries, the Louisville/UK football game was just restarted a few years ago. It stems off of the UK/UL basketball rivalry. But, as mentioned earlier there were other sports that USF and UCF did battle in.

There are a lot of rivalries that stem from the mere circumstances of hate. FSU and Florida are one of those in my book, regardless of whether they are playing for national titles, both schools just plain don't like each other.

[Guest]

both schools just plain don't like each other.

I think that applies to USF and UCF as well...