What ever happened to USF's Swimming team?!?!?!

[usfgrad84]

Title 9 is the gayest rule ever.

That's pretty much the most idiotic statement I have ever seen written on this board.  Without Title IX you would not have ever seen Woman's World Cup Soccer, Ladies BB get to the level it has, ladies softball or a bunch of other sports come in to prominence.  In a lot of ways, the pre Title IX era was equicalent to MLB pre 1947.

Even if you are not a fan of these ladies sports, Titlte IX has had an effect overall in the world of sports.

[flsportsfan83]

Title 9 is the gayest rule ever.

That's pretty much the most idiotic statement I have ever seen written on this board.  Without Title IX you would not have ever seen Woman's World Cup Soccer, Ladies BB get to the level it has, ladies softball or a bunch of other sports come in to prominence.  In a lot of ways, the pre Title IX era was equicalent to MLB pre 1947.

Even if you are not a fan of these ladies sports, Titlte IX has had an effect overall in the world of sports.

I would have to disagree. Schools are forced to cut programs all the time due to Title 9. What womens sports have come into prominence? USF has 60% female students, thus 60% of our athletes must be female. It makes it real hard for males to get scolarships for olympic sports because schools with a football program many times cant afford to field other programs.

[Guest]

A couple of things to consider regarding Title IX:

For sports - the proportion of female student athletes to male student athletes has to approximate the general student body population.  Since USF's population ranges from 55-60% female, the student athlete positions are supposed to be about 55-60% female...  

Now, I believe they can ease some of the issues created by football with some non-academic scholarships.  For example, I believe I heard tat Justin Teachey is technically a walk-on, using an academic scholarship to pay for his costs.  Also, some other men's sports only give (or used to only give) half-scholarships to some men - thus counting for fewer issues.

It's been a long time since I was on the Title IX committee at USF (like 15 years)... but it really has been good for women in general.

Title IX does not only apply to sports.  Because of Title IX, we have more women lawyers, women doctors, women engineers, etc.

It may seem like a challenge for sports fans, but it really is a good thing.

[Guest JulmisteForPrez]

Title 9 is the gayest rule ever.

That's pretty much the most idiotic statement I have ever seen written on this board.  Without Title IX you would not have ever seen Woman's World Cup Soccer, Ladies BB get to the level it has, ladies softball or a bunch of other sports come in to prominence.  In a lot of ways, the pre Title IX era was equicalent to MLB pre 1947.

Even if you are not a fan of these ladies sports, Titlte IX has had an effect overall in the world of sports.

You obviously don't read a whole lot on this board, then.

It's an opinion shared by thousands, and I stand by it.  If you disagree, that's fine with me.

As Yakov Smirnov would say, "What a country!"

[usfgrad84]

As Jim said above, Title IX has opened a tremendous amount of doors to women in the general society.

It sounds like your opinion is formed simply on short sightedness based on only USF sports.

Outside of the USF sports world, there really is a whole world going on out there.  Didn't the US ladies, (Mia Hamm, Julie Foudie, Krist Lilly, etc) win a world cup and some Olympic Medals in Soccer?  Didn't the ladies Olympic Hockey team win some medals?  Right now ladies professional tennis is more popular than men's tennis.  It used to be a second class citizen in the sports world.  There are some pretty good ladies pro golfers that went to college on scholarships and the LPGA is very popular.  Once the college softball season is over, go ask Kenny Erickson what he usually does during the summer months.  Who is college basketball's all time winningest coach?  Pat Summit.  In some schools, ladies BB draws more fans than men's BB does.  That's just a tip of the iceberg.

Then, as Jim said, look at all the doors that have been opened up for ladies Lawyers, Drs, executives, etc.

As only a USF football fan or BB fan I can see your point, but there is a whole world happening outside USF.

[Gerdes]

At the risk of inserting myself in a Title IX debate, I simply wanted to add some clarification to the original question of what happened to swimming at USF. In the mid 1980s, the USF athletics department was in serious financial circumstances and it became evident that an extremely difficult decision had to be made on dropping a sport. Among other considerations, the fact that swimming was not a sponsored sport in the Sun Belt Conference (which we were in at the time), and the fact that it was a men's and women's sport, led to a decision to drop that sport. Priority was given to sports that were sponsored as championship sports in the Sun Belt. As finances improved - you saw women's corss country/track and soccer added (and much later sailing) - and all among Sun Belt sports.

John Gerdes

[LakeBull]

Title IX is similar to chemo therapy.   To get rid of cancer you basically take a poison.   Title IX has produced great results, but we are still stuck taking the poison and having to live with the side effects.  It is better than having out of control cancer, but it is still not exactly normal or healthy.  Title IX is legal discrimination designed to cure cultural discrimination.

[Guest JulmisteForPrez]

Title IX is similar to chemo therapy.   To get rid of cancer you basically take a poison.   Title IX has produced great results, but we are still stuck taking the poison and having to live with the side effects.  It is better than having out of control cancer, but it is still not exactly normal or healthy.  Title IX is legal discrimination designed to cure cultural discrimination.

Actually, that's pretty well put, LakeBull.

Thanks for that analysis.

:applause

[Warped]

We had reached the point where we were not competitive...don't know if it was coaching, funding or what but those two can often go hand in hand.  I believe the national championship was at a D2 or D3 level.  Is swimming a strong Big East sport?

Actually, the team was cut 1 year after winning the national championship at the D2 level.  That also means the team would've been somewhere in the top 25 of D1 schools if swimming at the same level.  The Big East is an ok swimming conference.  Of the BCS conferences, it's definitely the bottom of the pack, however still lands some schools in the top 25 (louisville, notre dame, sometimes wvu).  If a program was put in at USF and given any sort of resources at all (scholarships and a coach who knows what he/she's doing), given the talent in the state of Florida and the south for swimming, the big dropoff from FSU/UF to the next level (FAU, Univ of Tampa, UNF), and just the shear location, the program would be atop the Big East in literally no time at all.  

Doug Woolard has been quoted as saying he wants the best athletic department in the Big East.  You can't do that if you don't field the sports, especially the top Olympic sport.  The only other schools that don't have swimming programs in the Big East are the bball-only schools (Marquette, DePaul, and St. John's).  As an athletic department, it's pathetic that a football school in the state of Florida does not have a swim team.

(edit: Rutgers just announced they dropped their program.  The state of NJ cut funding to all state schools, and something had to go, especially after Schianno's pay-raise.  A bunch of programs were cut there)

[outrunner]

Title IX is similar to chemo therapy.   To get rid of cancer you basically take a poison.   Title IX has produced great results, but we are still stuck taking the poison and having to live with the side effects.  It is better than having out of control cancer, but it is still not exactly normal or healthy.  Title IX is legal discrimination designed to cure cultural discrimination.

Very well put and I agree. But if I might add, when do we know that the cancer is removed and what guarantee is there that the poison doesn't cause another form of cancer? Also, what about the "doctors" who implement the "treatment"?