Losers lose, and winners win

[BullsFanInTX]

Tired of the so called "process".  Winning programs win, end of story.  Don't give me almosts and getting theres.  Jose Fernandez is a winner.  WBB is a winner.  They have figured out a formula to win.  The men's basketball team is a loser.  I don't care how close they got, they lost, and will continue to lose, because they are losers.  Same with football, the program is a losing program, until CAG finds some way to make them winners. 

Winners win and losers lose, end of story.  Close enoughs and almost good enoughs aren't good enough.

Win.  By any means necessary within the scope of the rules.  Coach Fernandez has figured out how to do that.  

[Bull Matrix]

23 minutes ago, BullsFanInTX said:

Tired of the so called "process".  Winning programs win, end of story.  Don't give me almosts and getting theres.  Jose Fernandez is a winner.  WBB is a winner.  They have figured out a formula to win.  The men's basketball team is a loser.  I don't care how close they got, they lost, and will continue to lose, because they are losers.  Same with football, the program is a losing program, until CAG finds some way to make them winners. 

Winners win and losers lose, end of story.  Close enoughs and almost good enoughs aren't good enough.

Win.  By any means necessary within the scope of the rules.  Coach Fernandez has figured out how to do that.  

It is where they are at the moment. When I was at USF the women’s hoops team was terrible coached by Jerri Ann Winters. USF mens hoops won games and was on the bubble for the NCAA but ended up being in the NIT a few times under coach Seth Greenberg. The USF football team was still in its infancy but winning games against easier teams under coach Jim Leavitt. I guess I’m thankful that I had both revenue sports doing well while I was a student lol

[Dave_Glaser]

Most unappreciated coach ever at USF - Seth Greenberg.

He gets very little respect from Bulls fans, but he should, given the history of our men's basketball program. Seth's teams averaged around 17 wins and 8 league wins a year. That's something we've never approached since. He had ONE losing season - his first - in seven years as our head coach. Jim gets a ton of credit for building our football program - and he should - but his teams were never much more than average, especially in league play. Seth's track record at USF is very similar to Jim's. He never got over the hump in league play, and was always middle of the pack. And, like Leavitt, he had some really good non-conference upset wins - Florida State, Texas, Ohio State, Pitt and Wisconsin I remember well. 

Edited January 12, 2023 by Dave_Glaser

[Mike Stuben]

8 minutes ago, Dave_Glaser said:

Most unappreciated coach ever at USF - Seth Greenberg.

He gets very little respect from Bulls fans, but he should, given the history of our men's basketball program. Seth's teams averaged around 17 wins and 8 league wins a year. That's something we've never approached since. He had ONE losing season - his first - in seven years as our head coach. Jim gets a ton of credit for building our football program - and he should - but his teams were never much more than average, especially in league play. Seth's track record at USF is very similar to Jim's. He never got over the hump in league play, and was always middle of the pack. And, like Leavitt, he had some really good non-conference upset wins - Florida State, Texas, Ohio State and Wisconsin I remember well. 

Did he beat FSU too? I know Bobby Paschal beat FSU in the Sun Dome in his second to last season I think, Chucky Atkins had a big game if I remember correctly. Not disagreeing with you, I just don't remember the FSU win in Coach Greenberg's time. 

[Dave_Glaser]

1 hour ago, BullsFanInTX said:

Tired of the so called "process".  Winning programs win, end of story.  Don't give me almosts and getting theres.  Jose Fernandez is a winner.  WBB is a winner.  They have figured out a formula to win.  The men's basketball team is a loser.  I don't care how close they got, they lost, and will continue to lose, because they are losers.  Same with football, the program is a losing program, until CAG finds some way to make them winners. 

Winners win and losers lose, end of story.  Close enoughs and almost good enoughs aren't good enough.

Win.  By any means necessary within the scope of the rules.  Coach Fernandez has figured out how to do that.  

People are handing out credit for how we played No. 1 Houston on the road last night. With good reason. Understandable. It's the best showing we've had against a team of that caliber in a long time. But it means ZERO if you do the same old things and lose at ECU on Sunday and don't start to put it together and get some Ws against the other - lesser than Houston - teams in this league.

3 minutes ago, Mike Stuben said:

Did he beat FSU too? I know Bobby Paschal beat FSU in the Sun Dome in his second to last season I think, Chucky Atkins had a big game if I remember correctly. Not disagreeing with you, I just don't remember the FSU win in Coach Greenberg's time. 

He beat FSU several times, Mike.

[SilverBull]

Beauty (or ugly) is in the eye of the beholder I suppose.   While I've not been blown over by any USF Men's basketball coach, I was not a fan of Seth primarily because I never saw his teams improve over the course of a season.  I thought Paschal was somewhat underrated given his overall accomplishments and postseason record.  Probably the best to me was Heath, and he didn't take my breath away.

[Dave_Glaser]

6 minutes ago, Mike Stuben said:

Did he beat FSU too? I know Bobby Paschal beat FSU in the Sun Dome in his second to last season I think, Chucky Atkins had a big game if I remember correctly. Not disagreeing with you, I just don't remember the FSU win in Coach Greenberg's time. 

Just went and looked it up. Seth was at USF from 1996-2002. We beat FSU in 1997-98, 1999-2000, and 2000-01 seasons.

[Mike Stuben]

13 minutes ago, Dave_Glaser said:

Most unappreciated coach ever at USF - Seth Greenberg.

He gets very little respect from Bulls fans, but he should, given the history of our men's basketball program. Seth's teams averaged around 17 wins and 8 league wins a year. That's something we've never approached since. He had ONE losing season - his first - in seven years as our head coach. Jim gets a ton of credit for building our football program - and he should - but his teams were never much more than average, especially in league play. Seth's track record at USF is very similar to Jim's. He never got over the hump in league play, and was always middle of the pack. And, like Leavitt, he had some really good non-conference upset wins - Florida State, Texas, Ohio State and Wisconsin I remember well. 

One more thing. Seth worked to get people to the games. My time working in athletics crossed through 3 MBB coaches, and Seth spent a lot more time doing the work to get fans at the games. Not a knock on the other two, but a credit to Coach Greenberg. At times he drove us crazy, but can't blame him for wanting more for his program. 

[Dave_Glaser]

14 minutes ago, SilverBull said:

Beauty (or ugly) is in the eye of the beholder I suppose.   While I've not been blown over by any USF Men's basketball coach, I was not a fan of Seth primarily because I never saw his teams improve over the course of a season.  I thought Paschal was somewhat underrated given his overall accomplishments and postseason record.  Probably the best to me was Heath, and he didn't take my breath away.

Bobby rode one core group to success over a three-year period (Dobras, Alexander, Lewis, Russell) and then had minor success with the Chucky Atkins, Jessie Salters, Jerome Robinson team. Stan Heath produced the best single season in USF hoops history, and not much else. But nobody ever sustained the "success" that Seth did. No, his teams didn't improve. They were consistently mediocre. But six straight seasons of winning basketball would be pretty welcomed right about now, huh? Seth's seasons at USF: 8-19, 17-13, 14-14, 17-14 (NIT), 18-13, 19-13 (NIT), 15-14. Michael Kelly would be giving BG a lifetime extension with a track record like that, and I wouldn't blame him. 

Edited January 12, 2023 by Dave_Glaser

[Mike Stuben]

6 minutes ago, Dave_Glaser said:

 

He beat FSU several times, Mike.

Wow, bad on me for not remembering that. I'm getting old, and all the seasons are blending together.