Those who want UCF series are shortsighted

[BULLheaded]

BULLHeaded,

The point is these "proposed" schedules aren't moving that way. In fact I'd say we get more respect from the people that matter by beating a George O'Leary led UCF team than Indiana or Illinois anyday. Ya they are BCS, but lets be serious, neither team has ever been consistent winners as between the 2 programs over the last 10 years they have 2 winning seasons.

In fact I'll go a limb and say playing those teams HURTS us more than playing UCF. The games are being played at USF for 1 reason...recruiting. All of the BCS schools we've signed with have heavy recruiting ties to Florida (Zook-Illinois; Amato - NC State; John L - Michigan State) It gives those teams a better grasp on the recruits that we are competing for. However, they're good games so you HAVE to take them.

We have 5 OOC games a year, that's 5 games we have to fill on that schedule regularly. You can schedule other teams outside the ONE game, that win or lose can help the image of this team. Win in conference you'll be fine.

I think it's stupid to treat it like a situation where we have 1 game and debate whether to give it to UCF or someone else. I further think it's "shortsighted" to think we're gonna lose our BCS bid or not become a national power for playing UCF...

Ok, let me try and put it another way. You are taking the possible teams we could play in the future and assuming they will all be played in the same year (and ignoring the big 10 games) kind of like if this were the year that it happened our schedule would differ like this:

As is = McNeese, FIU & UCF

changed = McNeese, FIU & Buffalo

What I'm saying is that I doubt that would be the case, IMO taking into account all the schedule additions I think it would look more like this:

As is = McNeese, FIU & UCF

changed = McNeese, Buffalo & Mich St

so the first two "tuneup" games are still crappy teams that nobody cares about but the competetive game against UCF has been upgraded.

[BULLheaded]

Do you honestly think that is how they go about picking the teams on the schedule? I mean we're not discussing a website list, we're hopefully fairly intelligent football fans discussing what we think the actual decision making process of those in charge. So what I'm saying is that IMO, they schedule teams that fit in the categories I listed (doesn't matter what is publically released) so the removal of UCF is not related to the (suspected) addition of buffalo or Ball st.

Actually, I do.

Five non-conference games:

1 I-AA Game (Tune Up)

2 Mid Major Games (Both Tune Up)

2 BCS Games (Both Competitive)

Now, that may be how DW approaches scheduling... and as he works down the list of 118 other I-A schools, he might get a ways down his list before one is both willing to play 1 for 1s and has the slots available.

So to take it a step further, you think that UCF was scheduled as a tuneup game?

[Joe]

BullHeaded.

You're completely IGNORING the other two games we have to schedule...Michigan State will probably be one of the BIG 2 games. It's NOT replacing UCF.

I'll say it again, while playing these Big 10 teams are nice and I want to schedule teams like this. How is playing them more beneficial than playing UCF? I would argue it hurts our recruiting more by letting another team have exposure in an already saturated market. Lose to them and you've lost to two of the worst programs in the BCS. Beat them and it doesn't give you respect. We aren't recruiting much in the midwest.

But you know WHY we play them? Because it makes SENSE to play them. Economically and for exposure they're great games for USF. I'm glad we got them!

If we were having to make a decision, Big 10 or UCF I think there would be no question. However, that's not the case, we have room in the schedule and UCF offers just as much as those teams do. However, scheduling a team like Ball State or WKU doesn't.

[Guest]

Yes,

Several people on this site have stated that is what Wollard has said.

So Brett has a story stating that Woolard has proposed saying "Joe is on the same page with Jim."

No, that would be speculation.

;-)

[Brad]

Lose to them and you've lost to two of the worst programs in the BCS. Beat them and it doesn't give you respect.

I'm not BULLheaded, but I think games like this on the schedule (FOR THE AVERAGE FAN IN TAMPA) is going to give more legitimacy to the program than playing in-state UCF.  I think a lot of factors go into this and I for one know that I could drag more potential (darn, there is that word again) Bulls fans to a game against Michigan State at Raymond James than I could for a game against the school Daunte Culpepper went to.

[smazza]

There I said it.  Did some of you get mad.  Sorry, I just want you to stop and think for a minute.

Those who want the UCF series are probably the same type of people who would have wanted an annual series with Ga. Southern a few years ago.  Guess what, thankfully we didn't settle there, and we shouldn't settle here.

USF needs to dream big, I mean really, really, really big.   Keep dreaming big and don't stop til you get there.  Dream of being the next UM, FSU, Texas, or USC.  Yes, folks, it can happen.  It may take years, but don't stop till you get there.  Don't ever give up until you have hit the big time.  I'm not one to say we have already hit the big time or arrived yet like some have.  We have a long long way to go.  Think long term, think huge.  Don't settle until you have an annual series with another top 10 opponent and we are a top ten team.  Whether that be UM or another team.  Beleive and dream.  Go for the gold, go for an annual series with a top BCS team if it take 10, 15, or 20 years.

I don't think you realize the scheduling priorities for USF.

FIRST - No 2 for 1s or single game paydays for BCS teams.  BCS teams get 1 for 1s or nothing.

SECOND -  This is the breakdown that USF wants for it's 5 OOC games:

                        1 I-AA home game

                        1 BCS home game

                        1 BCS road game

                        2 mid major games

THIRD - Whenever possible, schedule 7 home games.  This can be difficult in years with three home conference games (can we get 4 of the 5 OOC games at home??)

Those three priorities are hard to fit into a Fresno State / Florida State "play anyone anywhere" mindset.

And no, you can't change the priorities until you are named coach or athletic director.

Does USC have a home and home with a WAC, Florida with a CUSA team, the answer is no and we should settle for no less, I'm not talking about 1 or 2 games ore even a 1 for 1, but a long term series.

Consider that Southern Cal only has 2 OOC games (+ ND) and Florida only has three 3 OOC games (+ FSU) and USF has 5 OOC games; it's a lot harder for those two teams to have long-term series with a mid-major.  Florida doesn't even play OOC games on the road - they generally do single-pay games and USF can't do that (yet).

LSU (a perennial Top 10 team) signed a long term series with Tulane.  Texas has four games coming up with Rice (2 home and homes).  WVU has four games with ECU (2 home and homes). These may be more the exception than the rule, but Top teams do sign long term series with mid-major teams.

These series with Mac teams are not long term so forget about those and don't focus on them.

Don't you dare settle for a long term series with a CDOA team, no matter how many butts it puts in the seat.  Whether 65K fans show up at every game.  Dream of winning national championship after national championship.  Don't use the excuse that we are playing ball state, those are just filler games on the way to the top, not a long term annual series.  Build a series with a team that can be a USC-Notre Dame, Florida-FSU,  UM-OSU, Texas-OU.  This may sound unreasonable to some of you, but the only way to get there is to dream of it.  It can happen one day.  Don't settle, just cause the other side screams and fans who don't think long term want to settle.  CJL and DW see the long term, the future, and the future is bright.  They are dreaming of bringing home everything to USF, and to do that you shoot for the moon, not settle.  Dream of being a top 5 team playing an annual with another top 5 team.  Yes we can.  We have nothing to gain by settling except to be brought down.  Don't just think of the dollars and fans, but of long term dreams, and don't stop till you get there.

We can dream about it... and it will come.

By the way, UL played AT Temple, the worst team in 1A, that doesn't stop them from dreaming national championships and neither will games at ball state, etc. for us.  Go check out their boards.  We have more big games coming I am sure, that will be added, those are just schedule fillers.

Thanks for reading.  Go Bulls.      

So, since we will be playing TWO GAMES against mid-majors every year, do you want them to be Buffalo, Ball State or UCF?

Doesn't seem to be shortsighted to me to play the game.  We still have the chance to play the big name programs.

---

I am not disagreeing with you, just wanting to make sure that your vision is based, a little, on reality.

who was bcs  home game last year and this year

[Joe]

I'm not stating Michigan State. That game isn't very harmful in fact it's a GREAT game to have at RJS.

However, I would argue that Illinois or Indiana (even Kansas) isn't anything that I would say adds anything more than UCF...if I had the choice I'd take the BCS team...however there is room for both. That's my point.

[smazza]

I may be short sighted, but as of now, there is not another game on our schedule with more interest than UCF.

See, this is where I disagree. To me, the UNC and KU games are a helluvalot more interesting games. We have historically not been very good in away games against OOC BCS teams. We did OK at PSU last year and had the win at Pitt in 2001 but these two games this year will interesting from that perspective ....... at least to me anyway.

i am short so i must short sighted

unc and kansas will not out draw ftu/ou/oc in tampa.they also will not get the same state media coverage

[smazza]

BullHeaded.

You're completely IGNORING the other two games we have to schedule...Michigan State will probably be one of the BIG 2 games. It's NOT replacing UCF.

I'll say it again, while playing these Big 10 teams are nice and I want to schedule teams like this. How is playing them more beneficial than playing UCF? I would argue it hurts our recruiting more by letting another team have exposure in an already saturated market. Lose to them and you've lost to two of the worst programs in the BCS. Beat them and it doesn't give you respect. We aren't recruiting much in the midwest.

But you know WHY we play them? Because it makes SENSE to play them. Economically and for exposure they're great games for USF. I'm glad we got them!

If we were having to make a decision, Big 10 or UCF I think there would be no question. However, that's not the case, we have room in the schedule and UCF offers just as much as those teams do. However, scheduling a team like Ball State or WKU doesn't.

THE ORIGINAL JOE HAS IT RIGHT

MAN WILL YOU ANTI USF/FTU/OU/OC GAME FANS LOOK FOOLISH IS USF LOSES SATURDAY

[BULLheaded]

BullHeaded.

You're completely IGNORING the other two games we have to schedule...Michigan State will probably be one of the BIG 2 games. It's NOT replacing UCF.

I'll say it again, while playing these Big 10 teams are nice and I want to schedule teams like this. How is playing them more beneficial than playing UCF? I would argue it hurts our recruiting more by letting another team have exposure in an already saturated market. Lose to them and you've lost to two of the worst programs in the BCS. Beat them and it doesn't give you respect. We aren't recruiting much in the midwest.

But you know WHY we play them? Because it makes SENSE to play them. Economically and for exposure they're great games for USF. I'm glad we got them!

If we were having to make a decision, Big 10 or UCF I think there would be no question. However, that's not the case, we have room in the schedule and UCF offers just as much as those teams do. However, scheduling a team like Ball State or WKU doesn't.

I guess I just don't see it that way, to me those games if they come about would be in place of the first two games of the year which you seem to be forgetting about. Truth is that if you look at what is being scheduled we have some on the schedule similar to the unc's & ku's and there is speculation that we are setting up games similar to the mcneese's & fiu's with nothing really in line with UCF. So your speculation is that we'll end up getting more lower tier non-bcs or 1aa teams to fill that spot and my speculation is we'll get either upper tier non-bcs or lower tier bcs teams. Right now all we can do is assume either way but I will agree that if we end up with a year of 3 or 4 teams at the level of Buffalo than we're screwing up. I also think that there is a large group of non-bcs teams that would be equivalent or better than UCF so I'm not really worried that we won't be able to replace them.