BrassBulls12

30 minutes ago, Triple B said:

I'm not on board with the heart and soul thing but he's definitely a Bull. I'm guessing he had chances to go other places but he chose here and as long as he left for the right reasons, he'll always be a Bull to me.

5 minutes ago, NewEnglandBull said:

Yeah I know I am in the minority on this but I don’t get that “green and gold” feeling for him at all. It’s more like “meh...he played one season and took us the Toronto Bowl”....

He is a Bull, if you ask him what his Alma Mater is, I hope he would say USF and throw up some horns. But, as the athlete who has made the most money in their respective sport than any other, he hasn't made any real significant contribution back to the university. I could be wrong about the first part, I hope I'm wrong about the later part, but that would be why I think maybe their isnt as much green and gold pride there as others. 

4 minutes ago, NewEnglandBull said:

Yeah I have never been on the JPP train that he is a USF Bull. He was on campus for 9 whole months. Hell, that’s a hockey season. Great player but give me a George Selvie every day. 

Yeah, not knocking the on field performance. Just not a guy I think of when I think heart and soul. Moffitt, Selvie, Hall, Mack, Flowers, Allen are a few that come to mind 

On 11/29/2020 at 11:16 AM, WhoRUSF said:

I appreciate players who put their heart and soul into USF. I have a JPP Bucs jersey

JPP is your example of players who put their heart and soul into USF? 13 games and leave early JPP? Seems like we were more of a means to an end. KJ didn't have to come back to struggling and rebuilding team. We should be thankful. 

6 minutes ago, puc86 said:

Yes because continuity plays absolutely no part in success despite all evidence to the contrary 

Minuscule compared to everything else in the context of this discussion. Would it have made us better, maybe, that’s a different discussion. But even then you just can’t say that a CJL lead USF would be a perennial AAC powerhouse. It might have been, might be right where we are because everything else that had nothing to do with him. 

And that's not to say right where we are in the sense of a 1-9 season, but were we are in terms of the pecking order in the AAC. 

46 minutes ago, puc86 said:

It’s really not a stretch to say if things stayed the same things would most likely stay the same that’s usually a pretty universally accepted idea, we then changed things and things changed which does not somehow translate into they would have anyway.

Except things wouldn't have stayed the same, Leavitt staying wouldn't have stopped us from being the AAC, it wouldn't have made Genshaft change her stances. These are changes that were going to occur with or without Leavitt. But I digress to the point that nothing that has happened over here has had any effect on how good they have become because of how they capitalized on the changes and the decisions that non football coaches have made. Leavitt doesn't change how much support the football program gets from administration. Ra Ra only goes so far. 

50 minutes ago, chapelbull said:

That's BS.  He's the manager ... period.  And the fact that they can compete in a division and league in general with the payroll they have shows that they work in their favor.   Lots of teams are "still" chasing a ring each year that spend a helluva lot more than they do each year.

7 out the last 10 world series champions have been ranked in the top ten in terms of payroll. 

the three exceptions: 

Stl '11- ranked 11th

KC '15, Hou'17 

Both of these teams tanked for years to hit on multiple high draft picks and cashed in on them. One of the teams paid their young stars and paid to bring in good to elite talent around them. The other one didn't, only one is still relevant, the other hasn't sniffed the playoffs since. 

the '90 Marlins are the only team to win a WS ranked lower than 16th. They were 25th, not 27th

Odds say that spending money wins the world series and it makes sense when you think about the fact that the players you really need to seal the deal are expensive. 

Now for the decision, it was predetermined that Snell would not face the top of the order a third time. I believe that was even what Cashed offered as his reasoning. It was not a baseball decision, it was analytical decision. A directive from the top to the bottom. I get that he may have been running the meeting that made the decision, but he made based on what he is being asked to do, which is run the club a certain way. 

But you are right, they can compete. year in and year out, they can compete. That keeps them relevant enough to make the team profitable and maybe one year, they will put everything together catch that lightning in a bottle and win it all. We haven't seen that yet, but it is a possibility. 

9 hours ago, puc86 said:

Yes of course is there is one thing Frost has proven it is that he is a juggernaut completely not impacted by the coaches and teams around him and he would have obviously done as good of a job against an established program than one constantly influx and completely lacking an identity other than being someone that people used to know.

So we can’t assume what inevitably ended up happening independently of USF would have happened, but we can assume that a fired coach from USF would have hindered the growth the UCF to essentially flip our current conditions ........ got it. 

7 hours ago, chapelbull said:

Who made it then?

And for the most part those trades worked in the Ray's favor

Front office analytics team. And No, it hasn’t. They are still chasing a ring.  They are really good at being really good though. 

1 hour ago, Triple B said:

And even though I hate like hell to give  credit to a murderer, can’t overlook the job that the pasty fat guy did over there leading up to those two. 

That’s true, I forgot about that. Their success didn’t just appear in 2010. They just didn’t take off until the AAC and the NY6 games. Which would have happened in  both universes. 
 

Frost and Milton have about 100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000% more to do with what is happening in orlando than us firing a coach.. 

Are you saying that if we had kept Leavitt, UCF wouldn't have hired Frost, that Milton wouldn't have followed him? We can turn this into a butterfly effect discussion if you want to but Occam's razor says, CJL's firing didn't really affect UCF.  They are who they are because what they have done.

16 minutes ago, puc86 said:

I will settle for three as long as they come with some wins against teams that I actually care about and aren’t made up entirely of AAC games that only a handful of people care about at all. I’m a reasonable person and if someone can even win the lowly AAC I will try to look at it as a turning point but there is no way that you can convince me that we would have had a relatively similar decade and be sitting again at the bottom of the AAC had we not decided to blow up the program. We have had a decade of disastrous instability that is ever changing by the new requirements for the next bad fit coach that needs to completely rebuild his program with his players that he will never even see graduate just to have the next guy come in and start back at the ever moving backwards year 1, year 0 year negative 1.  UCF went from never being able to beat us to now tying it up by going 6-2, that doesn’t happen without a coaching change or 5.

We would have still been in the AAC

Administration would have had the same standards that set back recruiting

He is not god or any other all powerful being 

we would still be here, albeit maybe one more conference championship.  But that's debatable as Leavitt had a losing record in the BE

Stop bringing up UCF, its just as nonsensical for us to bring them into our business as vise versa

5 minutes ago, NewEnglandBull said:

Don’t know if that thing was ever nice...

Thats fair, certainly no Hubble 

9 minutes ago, puc86 said:

Be more successful, it’s really quite simple actually 1-9 doesn’t quite do it for me, being below .500 and having a single good season to your name that ain’t it, driving the program into the ground really doesn’t impress me much, not beating any teams I’ve ever heard of before probably isn’t it either but if someone could actually try for once delivering the better we were promised over a decade a 5 coaches ago and maybe even string it together for a few years I am all for it and it’s past time to move on. That we thought it was so easy to do better and have yet to come close after 5 coaches and this much time is a shame and I really cannot believe that we have not actually succeeded as yet. I want to move on as much as anyone wants me to move on and it’s about time for someone to give us a reason beyond hopes, dreams, rebuilds, new players, next year and oh wait I meant three years from now. The time to fix things is passing and at some point if anyone actually does fix the mess our administration created there won’t be anyone left to even know it happened. Just win, that’s what you said you were going to do and it’s about **** time to deliver on that beyond an occasional flash in the pan that doesn’t even hold up to scrutiny of being better for a single fleeting season.

so four or five 8-5 seasons should do it?  Do they have to put in a full decade here? I mean, do we not consider the full landscape of college football and realize that we are probably in the same general position with or without CJL?

I think the honest answer for some on here is nothing.  

the bitter ex mentality drives me nuts.

On 11/28/2020 at 7:16 PM, Jonesy Bull said:

Snell is one of those cy young type candidates.  You really want to lose such a talent due to Rays philosophy?

lets not pretend like they haven't dealt away Cy young talent from 90 win teams in the past.....

On 11/28/2020 at 7:16 PM, Jonesy Bull said:

But Cash said he is still having sleepless nights having pulled Snell in the WS.

Not sure why, that decision was made the night before, and he didn't make it. 

Just now, puc86 said:

Believe as you will up in New England where it can sometimes be hard to find the lonely sunshine beam but in Tampa there was in fact traditions that were forming along with passion for the program, we then stomped that out in when fell swoop and have not seen it since. 

Just out of curiosity, what does a coach have to do for you to let CJL go?

This is why you can't give them nice things......

14 minutes ago, puc86 said:

If anyone had any ideas on how to do that we wouldn’t be as interested in the uniforms, right now it’s the only way we know how to generate something for people to discuss 

So just don’t have people talking or find another way. let’s not take this whole UCF approach where no publicity is bad publicity. Where has it gotten Oregon? They are still playing second fiddle to the generic uniform programs. 

12 minutes ago, puc86 said:

Maybe I just read his musings as being more ambitious than they actually were. I assumed he intended on taking his Clemson approach early on if it were a ten year plan I am not sure why he would even bother discussing it because one way or another he will not be here for that.

Well without the exact quotes, it’s hard to say for sure. I thought he was maybe asked about that policy because it was a discussion of how much of Clemsons culture could carry over and what not. 

I’ll point out that I won’t fully believe it until I see it, but he has talked about staying and committing long term. 

Just now, puc86 said:

Yes but it sounded more like my plan is to not do this but for this one time I’m going to make an exception, now it’s two times and I’m pretty sure next year it will be three which means that’s your new plan because it’s the majority of what your time here will be.

I hope it is three and four years. I didn't take his comments to mean it was only a one time thing. For me to do that, I would have to accept that he was going to build a Clemson like program in one year. There only a elite few that can take that stance on transfers. Clemson was built before transfers became popular so who knows what their stance would be if they were building now. I took it as, we have to make USF a brand that people want to buy into from the jump and not leave or get kicked off. When that time comes, you will see a lot less transfers. 

1 hour ago, michibull said:

Ohio State, Alabama, USC, Texas....

those schools seem to do pretty well branding generic uniforms. It's almost like...... In the end, the on field product makes the uniform. Just have to commit to it. 

48 minutes ago, jchem1995 said:

I thought he wasn't gonna take a bunch of transfers. He said this. But reality slapped him  upside the head. GO Coach, GO.

36 minutes ago, puc86 said:

This is the way I recall it too, I am happy to see that he is willing to pivot when his vision does not match his reality.

IIRC, he was talking about the culture at Clemson and wanting to build to that. He has been looking at and taking transfers from the jump. 

---

 

• Scott, whose staff hosts a big recruiting weekend starting this evening, acknowledged offensive line is atop his priority list approaching the Feb. 5 signing day and transfer-portal season. Currently, the Bulls have only 10 scholarship linemen, and Scott indicated a handful of them are banged up and could miss some spring practice.

“So that’s an immediate need for looking at some transfers that may be able to come in and add some competition and depth to our current room,” Scott said, “and also for some guys out of high school coming in.”

USF- 10

Collins- 17

Durr- 8

70%

Just now, puc86 said:

This is just way off base anyone can see that the slime uniforms were a million times better than our current green uniforms which are the biggest piles of uninspired generic garbage that has ever been produced for our football team, they are embarrassing.

Garbage bags would look better than slime. 

On 11/28/2020 at 12:02 AM, hm101 said:

Just got called out by WIll Turner too for the poor choice of language. 

Look, it's not the media's job to be fans, that's our job, but this is by almost every quantitative fact you can pull about this game, false. As in not true. Almost everything about this game actually leads TO hope about the future. 

I just started following Turner, I think he has been the best at covering the team this year.