Bull94

3 minutes ago, John Lewis said:

Others should probably do it when converting means you will win the game. See the Giants yesterday.

agreed. they should do it anytime it increases your chance of winning.

I'm glad Golesh isn't afraid to follow the math.

UF had no chance against UG whether they punted there or not. article was pretty dumb. they punted the possession before and it led to a TD.

People tend to be too risk averse. Fans and coaches alike.

Math says to go for it more often than you think. It increases your chance of winning.

This is a study on the NFL and there are circumstances that aren't always accounted for but it's a good guide.

NFL game management cheat sheet: Guide to fourth downs and 2-point conversions - ESPN

WWW.ESPN.COM

---

Curious about a fourth-down or 2-point conversion decision? ESPN's recommendation model can help.

18 minutes ago, olafberserker said:

You are putting down the program and it's fans.   And no ****.  No one has said otherwise.  It doesn't mean that we as fans have to sit there and accept that all these programs that were and should be beneath us are now our peers

I'm not putting anyone down. It sucks that we missed our opportunity. Fact is the ones that were just called up proved it on the field. we didn't.

clearly the big 12 wasn't as impressed by our history as some of our fans.potential wasn't going to get it done this time.

I guess we all should just cry and complain constantly now.

or maybe we should prove it on the field before we declare ourselves superior.

14 minutes ago, puc86 said:

Only after we decided to commit program suicide 

tied for 3rd in the 6th best conference wasn't good enough to get a call up. especially since we were so new.

heck Cincy was left behind and they had a much stronger case than us.

4 minutes ago, olafberserker said:

And?  We have a winning all time record against multiple teams in the ACC as well as teams in the SEC and Big 12.   Does that mean we are on equal footing with those teams and should be in their conferences?

Like I said, I would expect this crap from ucf fans, but someone who calls themself a Bulls fan and who has "been there from the beginning" shouldn't be trying so hard to put down our program and the fans that aren't happy with where it is right now.

I'm not putting down our program. I just think we need to win on the field to prove we are better than our conference mates.

4 minutes ago, puc86 said:

I would love to know how people look at the BEAST defector’s records since moving on, the Big 12 new addition’s records, heck even Nebraska and then conclude that having a .500 in conference record in a BCS conference 8 seasons after becoming FBS wasn’t doing what you were supposed to. The issue wasn’t that we were failing at that point it’s that we said screw success let’s try to invent all the ways imaginable to fail.

we were 22-34 in the big east

28 minutes ago, olafberserker said:

That's ********.   We have done things to separate ourselves from them, you just keep minimalizing it so you can take your holier than though approach towards other Bulls fans that were there and remember those things

I've been here since the beginning.

We are currently 14-19 (including this year)all time against the 6 conference teams we play this year that we have played in the past.

we have a losing record against 3 of them.

10 minutes ago, Mike Stuben said:

So, here is the history.....

We were planning on joining C-USA in 2001, when we went I-A, but one school blocked it, UAB. 

UAB was bitter that they were made to wait 2 years when they moved up before joining the league, so they made us wait. 

C-USA knew we we were planning on being in the league 2001 and 2002, so they promised to help us with scheduling, that is why we got some of those games. 

(I know you aren't talking about the same games, because the C-USA games are different ones, but we were forced to be an Independent for 2 years due to UAB)

interesting. Thanks for the insight.

I really appreciate our history and believe we have all the potential in the world.

I think now with the renewed commitment to athletics that we can earn our way into a better conference.

I'm just tired of people on here griping about our conference partners.

we have done nothing to separate ourselves from them.

1 hour ago, Mike Stuben said:

We were 16-6 in the two seasons leading up to the decision. So, its not like we were bad. 

All conference invites are based on potential. No conference cares about rewarding anyone for what they did, they only care what you can do for their conference in the future. 

interesting that in our 9-2 season we played 4 current conference members.

regardless of why they chose us, we did nothing with the opportunity.

17-18 under Leavitt in BE and 5-16 under Holtz.

at some point potential has to be realized.

3 minutes ago, Mike Stuben said:

We earned it with our potential, and the BE wanting a presence in Florida. 

I'm not sure you can earn anything with potential.

that means it's just given to you on the expectation you might be able to earn it someday.

8 minutes ago, Bull Matrix said:

Well said. What is amazing to me is how well USF’s attendance has been despite not having great seasons yet. Can you imagine how crazy it will be when that does occur? If I’m USF or other conferences i would be selling that aspect as much as possible. Tampa Bay loves football and the are starving & waiting on USF to get things going 

agree. can't wait to see a packed ocs. I understand life is cyclical. Just because we have gone through a down period doesn't mean we won't ever have success again. all those teams that "passed' us started well before us. it was USF that actually passed them

2 minutes ago, Mike Stuben said:

 

We already accepted the invite before the 4-7 season. So, that bad year had no impact because it was already done prior to it. 

so I guess we went 7-4 then.

still didn't get the invite because we earned it on the field.

12 minutes ago, olafberserker said:

Yes, we accomplished quite a bit under Leavitt.  Getting to a BCS conference in that short time span was quite an accomplishment in and of itself.   To besmirch it by calling it "luck" is something that should be reserved for ucf fans and the like not people that present themselves fans of the Bulls,  But to each his own

We got into the BE because of our connections. It had nothing to do with success on the football field. we went 4-7 the year before we started play in the BE

3 minutes ago, belgianbull said:

Not saying that we are better, just saying that we should be better. Its a shame that UCF, SMU, Houston have passed us, and that we are now in a position where UAB, Memphis, Tulane, FAU, UTSA, if we are not carefull, will pass us as well

no problem with that. Just gets old when people act like we have done something that gives us the right to look down on our conference mates

1 minute ago, olafberserker said:

He's essentially saying that what we did was lucky and what we are doing (or not doing now) is where we belong ...... 

No I'm saying it's not all that impressive and certainly not a reason to think we are better than all the other teams in our conference.

1 minute ago, Rocky Style said:

We did finish ranked multiple times but I don't know if that's what you are saying.

it is. I guess finishing ranked (19,21)twice is a huge accomplishment and a reason we should look down on our conference mates.....

4 minutes ago, olafberserker said:

you keep trying to imply/say we haven't accomplished anything.  We have, we just didn't build on it

what did we accomplish?

3rd place tie in the 6th best conference?

Maybe when we finished ranked?

some of you are delusional to think we have some great history.

FAU has won 3 conference titles. They are 4-1 in bowl games. Oh and they started 5 years after us.

just because we lucked into some conference call up means we accomplished something?

3 minutes ago, olafberserker said:

Middle of the Road in a BCS conference > bottom of the barrel currently

where did i say otherwise?

3 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

It sure is exponentially better than bottom of the barrel of fbs football over the last 5 years and being stuck in the aac because the coaches and ads can't win consistently more games than they lose over any spread of time. Golesh has to change this or we are doomed for the next round of realignment.  Not saying your wrong but Leavitt did way more with less than anyone coaching football so far. There are no excuses we are here because we haven't had success in coaching hires since he left. Willy had a great recruiting classes that made him look like he was a good coach on the upswing. History shows he can't sustain  winning anywhere.

again I'm not arguing who our best coach was.

Just that our history is nothing special and our fans shouldn't look down on our current conference mates as if they are beneath us.

39 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

He was 17-18 in a power conference and had a win percentage over 0.600. We don't have any other coaches closes to that so far. We have been waiting for 12 plus years.

I'm not arguing who our best coach was.

I'm saying we don't have some great history that would suggest we should look down on programs.

a 3rd place tie in the 6th best conference in the country is nothing special.

9 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

We were and fired Leavitt.  We can't hire a coach with any sustained success and only have one coach over 0.500 other than Leavitt.

While Leavitt was a good coach, he was 17-18 in the big east.

let's not act like we were anything more than middle of the road as a program.

46 minutes ago, SilverBull said:

Not trying to be contrarian, but I really do wonder what qualifies as USF's "glory" years.

Prior to this year we had lost to UAB once by 3 points in 2003, when we went 7-4 and were in the middle of the pack in CUSA, and beat them by 25 in 2004 when we were 4-7 and near the bottom of CUSA.

And before this year we lost to FAU once by 18 points when we went 2-10 and near the bottom of the American, but that year we did at least beat UConn.

I wouldn't call any of those our "glory" years, though I'm not sure myself what I would consider truly "glorious" about any of our past seasons.  Some were pretty good, but it always seemed there was at least one agonizing memory in each.

Glory years is just a reference to our past.

People act like we are some blue blood program with all this great success in the past and we should be insulted to play such lesser programs.

maybe we should actually start beating these programs before our fans act like we are so much better than them.

31 minutes ago, Triple B said:

Your last line is going to attract attention and move the focus away from a lot of the truth in the rest of it ....

the last line is true as well.

31 minutes ago, olafberserker said:

It's not the fans thinking this that is the problem.  I'm starting to think our coach(es) think that way and that's a problem

you don't think the players read what's on the internet?

I wouldn't doubt if things that are posted here are used as bulletin board material to get opposing players motivated.

the disrespect this board shows towards our conference opponents is ludicrous. it's been that way since the BE broke up.

I hate to break it to some on here but we are not some blue blood program that has some storied history.

we were  a middle of the road program at best in our "glory" years.

maybe we should actually prove something before our fans act all high and mighty.

BTW even in our "glory" years we were losing to programs like UAB, FAU and UConn

3 minutes ago, MaltLiquorBull said:

Yes.  Based on the way our team has played the last 2 weeks, it seems that the team went in thinking they were high and mighty, too.  We need to get back to playing with a chip on our shoulders--like we have something to prove.  Because we DO have something to prove, and we need to start proving it quickly.

I agree. we will see how resilient this team really is. they need to show some fight and prove they can handle adversity