USFFan

South Carolina has 24 yards rushing at the half?!?!?  I thought they were a stud running team.  They have 140 yards rushing - ON THE SEASON THROUGH 150 MINUTES OF FOOTBALL!  Maybe some of the Knights are reading a little too much into their ability to "shut down" South Carolina's ground game.  

Meanwhile, Penn State's held Central Michigan to 76 yards in the half while throwing for > 200 yards in the half.  Granted, it's Central Michigan, but for all the suggestions that Robinson's a terrible QB, he's looked just fine since USF held him to 90 yards.

I know - statistics are for losers, but it's more relevant than how we count people in the stands or whether some magazine says we have fat girls on campus...

USFFan

I've got a party to go to from 5PM until whenever, and will probably duck out sometime around 8PM.  Is there anyone that's not going to the game that could send me text messages with updates?

I have to go to a wedding tonight, so I won't be there, either.  I'm TiVo'ing the game to watch late this evening.  

I have an MSN Direct watch that sends scores to my watch, which is normally ideal (especially living here on the west coast since most of our basketball games happen during the commute home and I can't get them on the radio in San Francisco).  Unfortunately, for some reason the only college game it's currently sending to my watch is the Tennessee/Fl*rida game.  It's really pissing me off...

USFFan

Interesting post USFFan, but back to the topic, will you join the "Welcome Home HowieP" parade should he decide to come home?   ;D

As far as Rivals (and you have to add Scout now), those sites are Bulls sites as well and folks should be encouraged to visit both.

I think each of the three sites should link to one another and to allow links via signature lines.  I can't say that I have ever come across on either network that openly links to non-network sites (with the exception of the Rivals UCF site of all things).  I could be wrong, but that is what I see.

If that recruiting mom wants to see a vibrant communty, could someone post a link to this board?  

But back to HowieP... this thread is our plea to him to come home safely.  We won't ask any questions...  

Well, since what I was trying to say was that posters from each of the boards should be posting on all of them, then of course I'd like to see Howie posting here.  I presume he's still reading this board even if he's gone into lurking mode.  If not, those who want to see him come back will have to get over their own prejudice and post on Rivals, where Howie's been posting since the incident over here.

USFFan

That's not the case at all.

Much like those that do not wish to engage in mudslinging with UCF - they ignore it.  It is clear Howie wishes not to participate on a board in which people who do not know him can cast aspersions about him as you just did (and did before).  It's that simple.  We would like to have a large group of Bulls fans on here that don't go "message board personal" with each other.  It's the same reason many Bulls left the previous Rivals board and made this their home.  They could show their Bull colors and not worry about being overly criticized and called names by other Bulls that disagreed.  

Those that know HowieP know that he is an ardent  Bulls fan.  To be criticized for his phone call, when most are too lazy to call in themsleves, is disturbing to many, not just Howie.

I agree with you 100%  What I find sad is that ther are far too many USF fans on this site who simply refuse to even so much as post on Dave's Rivals site.  I think what most people fail to realize is that both sites have the same goal - to raise awareness of USF athletics and to provide an outlet for USF fans to exchange thoughts and information.  Way too many people on this site seem to view that Rivals site as if it's a bad thing.  In reality, the lack of traffic on that site gives the impression that there's a small and uncaring USF internet community.  Right now there's a mom of a prospect from Niceville who's been asking questions.  How does it look that she's gauging USF fan interest and doesn't see the multitudes of fans on here?  It's not like several folks on here don't know Rivals has a USF site.  

The snobbery needs to stop and egos need to be put aside.  It helps USF to have visible posters on network affiliated sites as well as on independent sites.  

USFFan

Wow.

Sounds to me like Mike Camunas needs to stop worrying about what is being written on these message boards and stick his nose in some books on grammar and AP style.

It seems like if Camunas doesn’t have his head up Jim Leavitt’s rear end it’s going to be up this MB’s ass.

Mike, stop worrying about the opinion of people who only want to hear good things about USF and work a little harder at not looking like a complete idiot – for the sake of The Oracle and the St. Petersburg Times (for which you have an obligation to act like a professional).

I know you feel a little tingle inside when you walk over the computer the day after you wrote a column that you knew the MB was just going to love. You see your little name in the title of a new thread and your pathetic life becomes complete.

Mike, report the news. Give the FACTS.

I hate to break this to you, journalism STUDENT, but not every article has to be written in a negative light, and a factual article that doesn't try to create a scandal does not mean that the writer is kissing the ass of the subject of the article.  

There are times when negative articles and opinions are warranted.  There are also times when positive articles and opinions are warranted as well.  The Oracle seems to have lost sight of that fact.  

USFFan

pretty simple....if you don't like it simply just do not read it....

I wasn't complaining about the smack per se.  I was responding to the guy's insinuation that the primary measure of fan interest is the amount of smack on their board.  

And, if you'll notice, I rarely get goaded into silly smack wars.  I guess that's why I don't have >7,500 posts even though I've been around these boards for a long time.

USFFan

It's just some of the elitist wannabe fans go to the other board and downplay everything.

Sorry, but if PSU, USC, Clemson or any BCS school we may be playing at a certain time can come talk smack, USF is not above it.

And I think therein lies the problem, at least as far as I'm concerned.  I know that I don't view "smack" as the ultimate college football experience.  To tell the truth, I actually hate all the smack.  I come onto message boards to learn about the sport and hopefully engage in some interesting conversation about the game that will enhance my enjoyment of it.  I don't come on the board to find out whether we have fat girls on campus (news flash - so does every other campus in the country).  

I guess I'm just getting old, but for me NCAA athletics was actually about rooting for your school to do well in a sporting event, not about engaging in a ridiculous debate about doughnuts, falsified resumes and pirate ships.  

USFFan

Not to commit heresy or anything, but I think the UCLA cheerleader is really the cutest one of the bunch...

USFFan

While I think it's importatnt to try to live up to the accomplishments of our predecessors, I think we have to make our own way as well.  

Like Mike said, we were the #2 paper in the Southeast last year, and I had an opportunity to visit the University of Georgia's newspaper over the summer The Red and Black, and the pure fact that we tied them is a testament to the hard work and reporting that we do at the Oracle.  

As much as people bash us, it is our responsibility to report the bad with the good.  If someone gets arrested, we have to report it.  If someone saves a family from a burning vehicle, we'll report that too.  

We've been labeled a "liberal rag" by many, and I agree that if the plane tips any farther to the left we're going to fall off at time, but these things are being hashed out so we can protect our credibility.  

The Oracle has definatly had to go through some rebuilding in the last few years.  I take my job very seriously (between dodgeball and NCAA2K6) and I am trying, along with my staff, to improve the paper.  

So, for those harboring "past problems" with the paper, you have to understand that these are new faces with different goals.  We'll be the best in the southeast come next year.  

I don't think anybody expects you to be a shill for the university.  However, in the recent past there have been numerous articles as well as editorial columns that have been decidedly slanted to shed the athletic department in a negative light.  While some issues with the department have been deserved (e.g. the Jerry Winters fiasco), many have not.  Hell, you had an editor plead with the university community not to be too harsh on Xavier Betia for missing a FG FOR FLORIDA STATE'S FOOTBALL TEAM!!!!  The result is that most of us who are alumni have developed considerable disdain for what was once a great college newspaper.  For better or for worse, the stain of the last few years will take a long time to wash away.  

USFFan

Mike,

I know I have been a severe critic in the past, however, this is a very well written column.

I can see why you also work for the St. Pete Times from time to time.

I hope, with your guidance, you can turn the Oracle around for years to come.

I was in school when Billy Lee Newland was the editor and the Oracle was the Best College Daily in the Nation.  The overall image I have of the Oracle is FAR below that standard.  (Long story, but I was at his wedding in the Marshall Center).

I believe this column would have lived up to Newlands standards.

I don't know who the editors were at the time, but when I was an undergrad ('80 - '84), the Oracle was something I largely enjoyed reading.  Now it seems they're more interested in doing more harm to USF than anything else.  I've seen countless articles ripping the USF athletic program almost to the point of the way L'Equippe has made it their mission to tear down Lance Armstrong.  I don't know if it's writers who are out to make a name for themselves or what, but I've lost all of the respect that I once had for the Oracle.  

USFFan

As for the attendance number, who cares, anyone that knows anything about USF knows how their tickets work.  Hell, just look at the Memphis game last year, USF says there is over 30,000 there when there could not have been 20,000 at the game.  Its old news.

Of course, the fact that it's old news, doesn't in any way affect UCF and has absolutely no bearing on the outcome of our football game on Saturday will not prevent you guys from continuing to post about it over and over and over and over again.  

I can't wait for this freaking weekend to be over with.

USFFan

you guys do this EVERY time somebody posts a non-south florida USF headline joke. if it upsets you that it wastes your time, don't add a post saying that, which keeps it at the top of the board so everybody keeps clicking on it. (i realize i'm totally ignoring my own advice here) just let it drift down to the second page and go away ...

greg

Seriously, if people spent as much time posting about USF stuff as they did worrying about whether a particular post did or didn't belong on this board we'd have twice as much USF material to discuss and debate.  

USFFan

ET,

Not really sure what I can add that hasn't already been written, but I'll keep you and your family in my prayers.

USFFan

Don't forget that little ole thing called Labor.  This isn't like painting a house, these guys are skilled, and they get serious dinero for painting.

"Nice job.  Who are the Chefs?"

One of the better football commercials in recent memory...

USFFan

Also, I have to admit that this is the first time I've ever heard the phrase 'chicken *****.'  I guess I'm just getting old and don't rate as OG anymore...

USFFan

Maybe so, but Dumig is also host of the Fox College gameday on XM radio.  From 9 -12 every saturday, he is national.

I'd forgotten about this until I just read STK's post, but I heard an advertisement that XM's college sports stations (ACC, Big 10 and Pac 10) is going to have a Saturday morning show on hosted by TJ Rives.  I hadn't seen that posted before and it was the first I'd heard of it.

USFFan

The blonde was doable, the other three would require mass quantities of beer, especially the one on the left.  The sad thing is they'd say the same about me...

The other three?  You need to step away from the keg yourself...  

USFFan

do you really feel that bad....he is still getting over $2MM....he will probably end up on TV for a yr then back in coaching....

I don't pity Huggins at all, but all of this self righteousness about Zimpher doing the right thing is getting out of hand.  She did what she did to make a statement that she's in charge and not for any other reason.  

USFFan

Regardless they went to a bowl and we haven't.  Call it timing, call it luck but that's the bottom line and until we go to one thhey have it over us.  We could have capitalized in 2003 our first year in CUSA and WE didn't win the games we needed to.

North Texas has been to several bowls, yet we beat them every time we played them.  Troy State went to a bowl last year.  I don't think that's the alpha and omega of a team's net worth.  Had the bowls been in the same position in 2002 that they were last year we would definitely have gone bowling.  

UConn was only admitted into the Big East last year because Virginia Tech and Miami left and they needed another member immediately.  Absent that, they undoubtedly would not have gone bowling.  I truly believe that they are in for a big fall this year, and I expect us to be able to take care of business up there.  

USFFan

Mav is from UCF... he'll hump anything with a hole.  That's why O'Leary hides his donuts...  ;D

That may be, but if you go to their Rivals site and see a post by SteveA., check out the brunette(s) in his .sig file.  Those girls are SMOKING hot...

USFFan

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=whitlock/050825

By Jason Whitlock

Special to Page 2

Nancy Zimpher, president of the University of Cincinnati, will be hailed in some circles and assailed in others for the bold stance she took with her basketball program.

She basically fired Bob Huggins for recruiting too many poor, academically and socially underprepared black kids. She called off the whole, tired charade.

I offer her praise. I respect her honesty.

She's uninterested in playing statistical games about who did and who didn't graduate. She's unimpressed with Huggins' charitable activities in and around Cincinnati. She apparently doesn't believe Huggins has a legitimate interest in helping the underclass.

With the Bearcats safely tucked in the money-generating Big East, Zimpher wants to fix the nasty perception that Cincinnati is a halfway house for lawless, difficult-to-educate black basketball players. Getting rid of Huggins is the first step in that process.

Yes, the saga continues. Another institution used poor blacks for its benefit, disrespected them in writing and then kicked them to the curb. Some will blast Zimpher and UC for its callousness. I won't. Again, I offer her praise. I respect her honesty. What must be questioned is the sanity of the black community that continues to allow its youth to be used by institutions that don't respect them.  

I spent the better part of two hours perusing the letters that flew between Huggins' attorney and UC's legal counsel this summer. Zimpher's message was concise and clear.

"Mr. Huggins continues to recruit individuals that exhibit a disregard for the law and respectful behavior," one of the university's letters read. "I fully understand that off-the-court trouble and the poor choices made by student-athletes are not restricted to UC's basketball team. Indeed, such discipline and control issues are a national problem. Yet problems appear to be more prevalent in Mr. Huggins' basketball program."

The letter went on to state that in a 16-year span, 21 of Huggins' players had run afoul of the law in a significant way, including three players/recruits who were scheduled to play at UC this season.

"In short," the letter continued, "although Mr. Huggins may claim some specific successes, the University is seeking an environment and climate where the development of the whole student is sought and the successful education of all our students is realized. And while some may argue that academically challenged individuals who experience difficulty conforming their behavior to appropriate norms deserve a chance at success that a winning college basketball team can provide, UC believes that it can better advance its mission by building a winning program around scholar athletes who earn degrees that will allow them to succeed not only in athletics but more importantly in life generally."

Now we can play games and pretend like we don't know what Zimpher and Cincinnati are saying. But we know what she's saying. We know the type of players Huggins used to resurrect the UC basketball program and garner personal fortune and fame. He raided junior colleges for poor black players, snagged an occasional transfer and patched them around other players from the other side of the tracks.

Those players served their purpose for Huggins. They elevated UC to a level where it would be worthy of joining a major conference, and now Zimpher and UC are ready to wash their hands of Huggins and his image-eroding junior-college players.

Yes, the saga continues. Another institution used poor blacks for its benefit, disrespected them in writing and then kicked them to the curb.

Some will blast Zimpher and UC for its callousness. I won't.

Again, I offer her praise. I respect her honesty.

What must be questioned is the sanity of the black community that continues to allow its youth to be used by institutions that don't respect them.

The University of Cincinnati basically just said that, for 16 years, Bob Huggins had little interest in educating the black athletes he recruited. That's not a secret nor is it much of a surprise. It's probably even unfair to blame Huggins.

The blame falls on the players, their families and the black culture that gleefully participates in and condones this exploitation because a handful of black kids sign NBA contracts.

Cincinnati, just like every other mainstream academic institution, has virtually no interest in properly educating the black underclass. It's not the mission of a mainstream institution. UC, Duke, Kentucky, Indiana, Ohio State, USC, Notre Dame and all the rest are set up to educate upper- and middle-class kids.

"Academically challenged individuals who experience difficulty conforming their behavior to appropriate norms" are not wanted at Cincinnati or at Boston College, Nebraska, Texas Tech …

And you know what? It's not in the best interest of those academically challenged individuals to go to Cincinnati. When you go someplace where you're not wanted, you get treated like you're not wanted. You get used. You get used by the well-intentioned basketball coach, the well-intentioned school president, the well-intentioned student body and the well-intentioned professors.

Black athletes participating in Division I sports graduate at an alarmingly low rate because the people running the institutions don't view the athletes as capable of being truly educated, and the institutions are ill-equipped to educate the black underclass.

Again, I want to thank Nancy Zimpher for her honesty and integrity. Maybe one day poor black athletes and their parents will study their history and realize that countless black leaders and professional athletes were educated and groomed at historically black colleges. There's absolutely nothing second-rate about the education, and black students are seven times more likely to graduate at a historically black college than at a mainstream institution.

Jason Whitlock is a regular columnist for The Kansas City Star. His newspaper is celebrating his 10 years as a columnist with the publishing of Jason's first book, "Love Him, Hate Him: 10 Years of Sports, Passion and Kansas City." It's a collection of Jason's most memorable, thought-provoking and funny columns over the past decade. You can purchase the book at TheKansasCityStore.com. Jason can be reached by e-mail at ballstate68@aol.com.

And yet, if it was right to do this, it was just as right to do it at the end of the last basketball season.  By waiting until now, Zimpher has effectively shafted Huggins by not giving him an opportunity to find a position elsewhere.  The timing of this is so bad that anybody would be hard pressed to say that it wasn't excessively punitive.  

USFFan

the one in the middle is not doable even after drinking 1/2 a keg!

I almost posted the exact same thing.  

USFFan

Actually, you are incorrect.  The Big East does not have a tie in with the Motor City Bowl.

From the Motor City Bowl website:

Wow, I stand corrected.  In previous years the Big East has been listed as being the "back-up" for the Motor City Bowl in an official capacity, but I can't find anything that states that now.  

USFFan

They didn't go to a Big East bowl last year, they went to the Motor City bowl and beat the MAC powerhouse Toledo...

They only received the invite because the Big Ten did not have enough bowl eligible teams.  The Big East does not have a tie-in with the Motor City Bowl.

Actually, that's incorrect.  The Big East does indeed have a tie-in with the Motor City Bowl for years when the Big 10 doesn't have enough teams (just like this past year).  In the future, the Toronto Bowl will likely be tied to the Big East with a Big 10 back-up so that the two bowls can swap teams if necessary.  

USFFan

for one hour today per the radio.  LRS was just on & heard a commercial for season tix this morn too.  It appears the AD is making a push to sell season tix.

In that same vein, how have season tickets sales gone this year?  The move to the Big East should have helped out...

USFFan