BullShirt

4 minutes ago, Cubanbull said:

And it will, the OCS won’t be ready until 2027 at the earliest, if we are not winning by then, then we have bigger problems 

And from today until they either say NO or finishing construction it will be a distraction.  This program just doesn't need any distractions right now in my opinion.

19 minutes ago, Friscobull said:

I was referring to USFRaider, try to keep up Skippy, appears you have taken one too many hits to the head, you are angry bro, CTE is for real. 

If you were referring to USFRaider then I apologize.  This thread has been going on for a few days and I'm typing while watching the tourney.  And while I did take a few hits I've been tested and as of now no evidence of any issues or preliminary warning signs.  But thank you for your concern.  And no, I'm not angry.  I'm very happy.  I know how Blessed and lucky I am.

23 minutes ago, Cubanbull said:

I think that no one will tell you that an OCS replaces winning. I also do not think that USF gets involved in building a 200 million plus OCS to distract anybody. As I stated on my previous post as long as I have been a donor to the program since 1982, USF’s Athletics have been slow and very frugal in moves, in fact in most peoples mind way to slow and frugal. So an OCS of that cost is not something USF takes on unless a huge donor is funding it, which we know is not the case, or a Power Conference has told USF you need one to be chosen. This is something I heard repeatedly since football started at USF by those in power. 
And yes an OCS for a USF winning football program does more in building student and alumni support than RJS. RJS will always be the Bucs home, it never even when we were beating WV in a packed stadium felt like a college atmosphere.

So there you have it.

#1 USF MUST win, first and foremost, but doing that doesn’t preclude building an OCS

Again, we're pretty much in agreement.  You said  "USF MUST win, first and foremost...". I just think the winning needs to happen before the "building".

5 hours ago, Bear said:

When USF was winning, is when they should have invested in the football program (IPF, OCS). The program was short-sighted and settled for mediocrity. 

This is correct

And there it is "When USF was winning, is when they should have invested in the football program (IPF,OCS).  That's what I've been getting at from the beginning.  They need to focus on winning NOW, stadium later.  The comments from people saying they want BOTH right now give the impression they think they are at a buffet and they can just get whatever they want.  But I do keep pointing out that IN MY OPINION a winning program at Ray Jay could be FUN, energetic, well attended, a recuiting plus, etc.

I have not put this out there before but I have asked some of the guys from my playing days their opinions of being recruited in high school and potentially playing in a pro stadium when they were in college.  I have not put this out before because the question was obviously asked after their playing days were over but a huge number of them said playing in a pro stadium would be a neutral or POSITIVE factor.  Only a few said not playing on campus was a negative for them.  And all of my college contacts are Big 10 while my pro contacts are lots or schools and lots of conferences big and small.  Again, for what it's worth.

On 3/26/2022 at 4:51 PM, Friscobull said:

He is using the savings of the cancellation to go to Raiders games in Vegas.  I think he mentioned this a half dozen times.

Hope you're not referring to me.  If you so your reading comprehension skills need some attention (just like your ego).  I've never been to Vegas, I don't gamble, I have not mentioned the Raiders even ONCE but I did play at the Raiders more than once so there is that.  Was that brief enough and "dumbed down" enough for you?

On 3/26/2022 at 4:38 PM, John Lewis said:

Not sure I would qualify someone as “hardcore”, who has mentioned on multiple occasions that they are dropping their season tickets.

I don't think he was including me in that comment.

On 3/26/2022 at 12:23 PM, El_Toro_86 said:

Only on TBP can a thread on CBG and MBB derail in to mud slinging about the merits of an OCS, attendance and conference USA 3.0.  I guess someone will be chiming in on Publix subs and uniforms any minute now

Sorry I didn't respond sooner.   We stopped by Publix to pick up some subs and beer and I got distracted by a couple of the girls and their uniforms .  I'll try to be more timely next time.  

On 3/26/2022 at 10:41 AM, Cubanbull said:

True and the only way to grow them, is by getting students involved and winning to create that tie in.

Here is a simple story I went to USF 78-82, we didn’t have football, so basketball was the “big” sport, even homecoming was around basketball. For the first years we didn’t have an on campus arena, we would play downtown at Curtis Hixon, Tampa Fairgrounds and even in St Pete. Most of my friends were not sports oriented so getting them to join me and driving to one of those games was close to impossible. Once we built the SunDome getting them to games there was much easier and even now they talk about the fun they had doing that.

Thats the one thing an OCS will do that RJS will never do, we need to create those experiences with the current student body.

Cubanbull,  You said "the only ways to grow them, is by getting students involved AND winning...".  I think we probably agree on almost everything that has been debated here.  I just think WINNING is more important and will lead to more student involvement at Ray Jay or an OCS.  I just don't have the confidence in the AD and the "powers that be" to think they can do both simultaneously.  Personally, I think "a shiny new OCS" is somewhat to get fans, alumni, etc. to focus less on the dismal performance of the FB and MBB teams right now.

But I will admit that I really do think if USF was winning BIG and filling RayJay that the place would be full and rockin' and fun and energetic and.....  I'll also believe that a WINNING program that is pretty much the only one playing in an NFL Super Bowl caliber stadium could actually be a recruiting plus.  Furthermore, if going to games was FUN (and no one likes losing) students would go.  They use to go to MBB games at the Sundome (I know because I was there too) but pretty much not anymore.  There's been a LOT of games when there were more members of the BAND at a game than students.

 I'm not totally against an OCS.  I just think a 100% total focus on  winning is what's needed right now.  An OCS is a distraction that a bottom feeder doesn't need at this time.  If they start winning that would be the time to consider whether an OCS makes sense/cents or not.

On 3/26/2022 at 10:32 AM, Triple B said:

Dude, go to the first post of the thread. He's not getting fired ........ now stop interrupting.

That's right.  Somehow with one comment about how we don't need an on campus football stadium in my earlier post about firing Gregory this has become a football thread, not a fire Gregory thread  anymore.  Please try to keep up.  (See, I have a sense of humor too but those that know me have never doubted that).  

On 3/26/2022 at 12:16 PM, Friscobull said:

**** dude, you ever hear of brevity?  You can easily quantify the expenses of an OCS but harder to gauge some of the benefits which you are ignoring. Thanks for the advice that winning would increase attendance, that is groundbreaking.  If we need to raise some fees to pay for it then so be it.  The ROI may not be prove to be enough for a business venture, the CBA would probably not justify it either but this is a state school that is full of bloat and inefficiencies, an OCS is not going to break the bank and if it does we can get creative with new revenue streams.  Lighten up Francis and let us relish in our dreams, calling everyone ignorant and hypocritical is off putting. 
 

 

"ever hear of brevity"?  Aren't you the one that said "let me dumb it down for you"?  And now you want brevity.  Next time I"ll use small words and lots of pictures for you since you appear to NEED things dumbed down.

On 3/26/2022 at 8:50 AM, michibull said:

Look man, I’ll lay this out for you quick and easy. UCF was playing off campus, struggling with attendance, apathy and on field performance (this was actually confirmed by a UCF fan on this board). We passed them by and got into the Big East, it rocked them to the core and from that point on, they sold out and spent huge amounts of money on facilities, OCS, marketing, and student engagement. The wins started to follow, attendance went up and media perception went up as well; but it all started with facilities and an OCS (which ours will be much better quality). Now it’s one example but it’s also an important example because they kind of mirror us in a lot of ways. So to be honest, you take take everything you have said and flush it down the toilet, because UCF single handedly destroys every argument you have used as to why building a stadium first won’t bring wins. Yes, there were good coaching hires, good recruiting, but the OCS helped them with that. Most of us that want the OCS see that it will help us in so many other ways that will help the university, students and football. Sports are a BUSINESS, the entertainment business; entertainment is successful through experiences and an OCS will greatly help with the college football experience. You clearly are ignoring that part. Why do you think car companies spend so much time, money and effort in the interior of cars? It’s called “driver experience”. It’s why you buy Cadillac, BMW and Lexus. The German 3 don’t actually build more reliable cars than others, that’s just branding, what they do is build a cars that give the driver a more luxurious experience. Yes, I know about these things because I am an engineer that develops heated and cooled seats, so I have to work the mechanical and studio aspects of seating and interiors. The OCS is part of selling a product, not real estate. Do you think “the swamp” would be as good if Florida played at Hard Rock, or if Georgia played at Mercedes Benz stadium, NO, they wouldn’t. So realize that the OCS means so much more than dollars and cents. Sorry, I was gonna make this quick and then I got lengthy with it, haha. 

You said "we passed them (UCF) by and rocked them to the core."  Didn't that happen while USF was playing at RayJay?  Thanks for making my point.  We can and did have success without playing on campus.

You think the UCF "wins followed" because they built a new stadium?  No, I'm sure they wouldn't have won any games if they still played in the Citrus Bowl (which was nowhere near as nice as RayJay - no comparison).  LOTS of schools HAD TO HAVE a remodeled or new stadium and it didn't help their records one bit.  Same with the NFL.  And many didn't see an appreciable increase in attendance and those that did lost it within 3-5 years if their records didn't improve.

YOu also said "sports are a BUSINESS".  Thanks for pointing that out.  Playing professionally for several years somehow I missed that.  We're talking about COLLEGE sports here, namely football and basketball.  And by the way, outside of about a dozen colleges ALL colleges lose money on their sports programs including USF and UCF so it's really hard to say they are running a business.  If so they'd be out of business  by now because they'd be bankrupt.

Interesting that you picked "the swamp" for your example.  A school that sells out 'The Swamp" when they have great teams and win championships but loses fans and GIVES AWAY tickets when they aren't dong well.  And just to be up front and honest here, I've been to far more games at the Swamp over the years than USF games. Remember, I'm not a USF Alumni so I don't feel I HAVE to go to USF games.  Plus, I entertain clients at games and a good/great team or game ALWAYS trumps a mediocre or even good game.  Think about that.  THe Swamp is 3 hours away and in the BUSINESS world my clients have indicated they would much rather go to a Florida game than a USF game.  And pretty much none of my clients are Florida Alumni either.  In fact when Florida was dominant a few years back and winning national championships I had clients more interested in going to Gainesville than watching the Bucs play locally.  RayJay tops The Swamp across the board so it's not about the facilities or the location thereof.  It's the trade off between time spent (not money because I pay for everything) vs entertainment received.   WINNING.   I'm not onboard with the OCS because I personally think it's a distraction from the bigger issue.

Let me ask you this (and be honest).  If USF was playing like UF played a few years back when they were winning or contending for national championships and RayJay was PACKED (which it would be because people are fickle and will jump on the bandwagon when a team is winning) would anyone really be clamoring for an OCS which would definitely be smaller than RayJay?  And I realize that comparing USF in the Big East / AAC is different than comparing UF in the SEC but you decided to use UF as an example so I think it's fair to continue that comparison.

37 minutes ago, Triple B said:

Comparing banks renting their locations to give them more money to make loans to a university's decision to where they play football makes me wonder if you understand this stuff ....

 

It sounds like you're saying that if we build the stadium we're destined to stay in the AAC. If that's the case, you REALLY don't completely understand what's going on ....

Do you really think USF didn't get invited to the BIg 12 because they don't have a stadium on campus?  As someone else pointed out USF has the worst combined record in D1 football and basketball over the past year and I think they said the 2nd worst record in D1 over the past 2 years.  Nobody wants to be associated with that.  Not the Big 12, not the fans, not the alumni.  That's why they don't go to the B ball games and why attendance at F ball is falling.

If USF had a 1 or 2 loss season each year and a marque victory over a BIG opponent every other year over the past 5 years in F ball and a "decent" B ball team they would have been the 4th invite to the Big 12.  In fact, the opportunity for Big 12 teams to get to play in RayJay would probably be looked at as a positive.  I can personally tell you that I know lots of opposing players look forward to playing at RayJay when they come here.  It's a pro stadium and that's where they all want to go, pro.

And to the poster that questioned whether I'm really a fan.  Yes I am.  What I am not is an Alumni and I think that gives me more objectivity than most people.  I didn't go there and I didn't "drink the Kool Aid".  I grew up in sports, played at the collegiate level and played at the professional level.  My sports history has been a HUGE part of my business success but my two degrees play an even bigger part.  The sports history opens doors, the education closes deals.  I'm a numbers guy.  Data analytics and number crunching is easy for me.  Just blessed with that.  And I do know the difference between public and private financing and the part of my previous post that discussed banking and the part about building a stadium were addressing two different issues and were in different parts of my post.  I was addressing the comment the previous poster made about renting vs owning real estate and how the wealthy only own, not rent.  The banking example had nothing to do with stadium financing.  I was using it as an example for renting real estate vs owning real estate because everyone has been to a bank and can relate to it. But you already knew that.  You're just reaching (poorly I might add) at this point.

How about a show of hands here?

How many people that have posted on this topic have SEASON football or basketball tickets?

How many have BOTH?

IF you don't have season tickets did you go to at least half the football home games and half the basketball games?

If you have answered NO to every question so far (except the BOTH question) thank you for playing, you can leave now because how can you possibly be a "fan" if you don't support the team?

If you answered YES, what would you rather have?

A new stadium with the same old results

or

stay at RayJay and the team actually play better?

In the end here's the problem.  You have a fan base that has spent years inside RayJay.  Yes, the colors are wrong and yes the team "pays rent" but it's a nice place to play.  And has anyone actually seen the data for where the season tickets holders come from?  I"ve not seen the numbers but I've had someone who is in a position to know tell me.  You'll be asking a lot of people to drive farther, through more traffic to go all the way to campus.  From the numbers I've seen tossed around the on campus stadium will be much smaller.  It may look "fuller" but in the end, the real decision are made based on the hard numbers, the data analytics.  Not "does it look fuller".  And consider this, what is the number 1 things in all surveys that people like to do at football games (other than win)?  Tailgate.  I've heard the sports fields including on the south side of campus by Fowler are off limits because there would be too much damage to the surface and they have to be ready for other uses.  (I guess they've been to a few of our tailgates).  So where does everyone tailgate?  I"m not saying it can't be done it's just going to be difficult and I don't know that this is the time.

WInning is like a wave, it creates momentum.  Just like a surfer rides the momentum of a wave (I surf) USF can ride the momentum of turning the F ball and B ball programs around to build a new stadium (and then a new B ball facility if needed).  But I think the winning needs to come first.

17 minutes ago, JTrue said:

Meh... In the history of the world, rent has never been a better financial option than owning. That's why rich people own the property poor people rent.

You must not be in business.  LOTS of businesses choose to rent not own their property.  And numerous studies have shown that rich people got rich by owning businesses that allowed them to purchase, not rent, PERSONAL use real estate but that's not what you said.  Coming in second was inheriting money but that was usually from parents or grandparents that owned businesses.

Just look at the largest companies in America.  Now check their financials and you'll see just how much they own vs. rent.  It comes down to taxes and the allocation of capital.

Rent is 100% deductible, buildings are depreciated over 39 years.  Land can not be depreciated AT ALL.  The capital that is freed up by renting the real estate instead of owning the real estate can be deployed to other more profitable parts of the business generating higher overall returns.

Take banks for example, most don't own their branches, they lease them.  That frees up money to make more loans which are much more profitable over the long run resulting in making much more profits / money over time.

For crying out loud.  You people are arguing with me over building and financing a new stadium and you post comments like that?  Am I the only one on here that understands this stuff?

I'll tell you what.  Go build your stadium.  Make sure you personally contribute to it and buy season tickets (or else you are a hypocrite).  Play your games against Tulane, E Carolina, UT San Antonio and N Texas and have fun in the Almost A Conference.  Then when no one shows up to watch you can complain here all you want.  Maybe they used the wrong Bull for a mascot or the wrong shade of green on the stadium.  Or the 5th AD in 12 years shoulda, coulda, woulda done this, that or the other.  And by the way, Memphis is gone within 2 years (write it down) because they don't want to be in the AAC.  Enjoy adding Southwest Missouri State to your conference.  I"m sure that will move the needle on the attendance in your new stadium.

14 minutes ago, NewEnglandBull said:

Trust me most alumni give lip service to high grad rates, top academic programs, etc. but really, are you going to use those on Mondays at work when you are surrounded by other people who are alumni from programs that are kicking ass? In reality most of a alumni care more about sports than we do academics. Sad but true. What matters is the front porch. My point about alumni now visiting campus has as much merit as your point saying that they won’t. Finally, having the stadium will allow you to have more purpose than just football games. Yes you have to pay for maintenance but that’s a part of the ticket price. Playing in a pro stadium with red seats and a pirate ship is purely bush league.

Maintence may be "part of the ticket price" but the point I keep trying to make is what makes you think you can sell those tickets in the first place?  All fixed and variable costs are part of the sales price of any product but that doens't mean people buy it.   And now we're back to attendance.  Good attendance at either facility solves your problem and mine.  But in the end I think the ONLY thing that will help with attendance is the teams' records and that starts with Coach Scott (who I was against signing but would give him 1 or 2 more years) and Coach Gregory (who I was against signing and would fire him today).

The thing I think A LOT of posters on this board are missing is the APATHY among a huge portion of the fan base.  A new stadium will move the needle a little.  A new coach, different attitude and culture resulting in MORE winning will move the needle a LOT.  It always has and always will.

Let's do this:  Reverse the football and basketball records.  Change each teams losses into wins and their wins into losses.  Are we even having this conversation?  No.  Does this thread even exist?  No.   Now put the records back to where they really are today but build an on campus stadium 5 years ago.  Are we having this conversation?  No.  I think the conversation is "why doesn't anyone go to the games, what idiot decided to spend all of that money on a stadium we didn't need, why did USF cut "this" program or "that" program when they had money to build a new stadium they didn't need".

At the end of the day, from my personal playing experience and business experience I can say with absolute certainty that if USF was winning that WOULD make a difference.  But no one here can say with certainty that building an on campus stadium will accomplish anything.  That being said, I think time will tell because in the end I think they will build a stadium.

7 minutes ago, Triple B said:

No they wouldn't if they were still AAC and there's absolutely nothing to support that they would ...... and I'm not sure why you keep staying fixated on the attendance. Unless I'm mistaken, very few, if any, have asserted that an ocs would increase it outside of the students.

I'm "fixated on attendance" because in no particular order:

1 It generates revenue,

2 It's a very good gauge of how the program is doing

3 High attendance spills over into other areas including fund raising.

4 High attendance generates a higher level of "game day" excitement.

5 If the team plays on campus like they do now how many students will go?  They don't go to MBB games now and those are on campus.  Students can attend games at RayJay if they want to but they don't want to.

6.  If they don't get decent attendance on campus how do they justify the expense of building a stadium?  And from what I've read so far beyond the $5 Mil that they got the other day there hasn't been a lot of people lining up to donate for a new stadium.   I would hate to see funds that could be used for education ultimately going to a stadium that isn't needed.

9 minutes ago, NewEnglandBull said:

Why pay the Glazers? Keep the $, build up alumni visiting campus and let’s have something USF related we can be proud of. 

A lot of assumptions there.

Remember, when you own it ALL of the YEAR ROUND maintenance costs are your responsibility.  Doubt very many people have any idea how much it costs to maintain a stadium, let alone the electric bill for one night game.  It's BIG.

Build up alumni visiting campus?  All because of a new stadium on campus?  Let's check back 5 years after it's built and see how that worked out.

Proud of?  How about a winning record?  High graduation rate?  Top rated academic programs?  I'll take those over a new stadium any day.  And I played in some really nice ones.

45 minutes ago, Cubanbull said:

Yes you have said repeatedly. I disagree is not the same but you do what you need to do.

WIthout giving too much away, I played football at a Big 10 school and professionally so I've played in big stadiums and small.  I've played on and against teams that were good and bad.  I've played in bowl games and playoff games.  I've been around people my whole life that LIVED sports.  My nephew is a college basketball coach.  That's where most of my basketball KNOWLEDGE comes from as I have very little experience (I played in high school but that's it).  After I "retired" I went back to school and got my Master degree.  I went to law school but didn't finish as my "day job" became more and more successful along with the time commitments it requires.

Being around people most of my life that LIVE sports I've learned a few things.  One of them is that people are very much blinded by issues involving "their team".   And trust me, it only gets worse if you are on "the team".

And in all of my years of playing one thing became very clear.  Winning fixes EVERYTHING, especially attendance.  If USF was taking names and kicking "ask" and packing them into the third level at RayJay NO ONE would be complaining about where we play.  If USF were routinely ranked high and playing in good bowl games things would be very different.  But I'm telling you, "if you build it they will come" is nothing but a movie line.  "If you win it they will attend it" is the TRUTH when it comes to football and MBB.  But at the end of the day, how much attendance do you really expect playing in the AAC?  I can't imagine season average attendance much beyond 30 to 40 k in the best case scenario playing in the AAC.  USF would have to schedule at least 1 or 2 BIG schools and routinely beat them if they want to get a high ranking and good bowl game that brings with it good attendance.  Without that, how many people really will attend USF football games to see AAC opponents whether at RayJay or an on campus stadium?

45 minutes ago, Triple B said:

You are okay with the money we spent on the IPF though, right?

Money needs to be spent on practice and sports facilities in general, no issues there.  If they had not torn down the old Sombrero after they built Ray Jay and that's where USF was playing their games then USF would need it's own stadium.  I'm not against spending money when and where it's needed.  I just personally think winning would do A LOT more for attendance than a new stadium.  And after "the 3 little pigs" leave the AAC and the "irrelevant 6" arrive, I think  more people will look at the cost and time of attending football games and opt out, regardless of where the games are played.  Same for basketball.

15 minutes ago, Friscobull said:

You are missing the point that we are all trying to explain so let me dumb it down for you.  Our product is ass and that we can all agree with, If we are to survive then we must improve, this we also all agree with.  An OCS will generate an excitement and brand loyalty that is not going to happen at an NFL stadium with a bunch of empty red seats. We are trying to move out of the G5 purgatory and to do this we need facilities, so we are building facilities.  We all know we need to win, however we can’t do that so at least we are doing something constructive while we suck ass. We are like AMC, pinto and a gremlin combined, we are trying to be a part of the big 3, and doing the same old BS ain’t going to cut it, hopefully we can become a Camry someday.

"let me dumb it down for you".  No thanks.  I don't need to stoop to your level and be dumb.  You seem to have already cornered the market on that.

23 minutes ago, bulloni said:

1.) The stadium going from Ray Jay to USF won't make a difference in non-student attendance. There are 663,104 people within 10 miles of Raymond James and 614,749 people within 10 miles of the proposed sycamore site, anyone that lives further than that probably won't mind the distance between the 2. The issue with Ray Jay is a lot of students don't have cars and don't want to uber or take the bull runner to a game. USF has 6k people in the dorms now and even more than that in the apartments within 2-3 miles of where that stadium will be. Accessibility for them will outweigh any people we lose because USF is too far but Ray Jay isn't.

2.) People will show up at first because the novelty of a new stadium, but I agree we need to win to get them to continue coming back. If we get 25k a game for a 2-10 team now, we'll get 25k for a 2-10 team a few years after that stadium opens. The silver lining is 25k in a 45k stadium will look a lot more respectable on TV than 25k in a 70k stadium with red seats and a nice club section that everyone hides in anyway.

I know Football and MBB are different sports.  But the Dome being on campus does NOT help MBB at all.  If the team was better people would attend.  Same for football in my opinion.

Yes, a new stadium will attract the "hey, let's check it out crowd".  But if the team still sucks that "goodwill" won't last until the end of the season and people will be complaining about all the empty seats.

2 minutes ago, bulloni said:

In 2016/2017 we we're amazing and had fun players to watch and broke 40k attendance in a conference home game 1 time in the 2 years combined

How did the best best teams in the AAC do in attendance?  I honestly don't know.  And don't lose site of the fact that it is the AAC.  It's not like someone is packing 60,000+ into their stadium week in and week out.

How many were in the stands at the UF game this year?  Who you play matters almost as much as how you play.

Also, how many times did USF play on a week night?  That's a non starter for a lot of people unless you're Bama or someone like that.

And lastly, don't forget the HOT weather.  It is a factor that a new stadium won't fix unless they build a dome.

3 hours ago, USFRaider said:

This very well could happen. 

This very well WILL happen.

There, I fixed it for you.  But at least you'll have a new football stadium to look forward to and after that the powers that be will try to convince you that the only thing wrong with the MBB program is the dome which they will want to replace.  But in the meantime, just keep renewing those season tickets.  Things will get better.  JUST TRUST THEM.

6 hours ago, bullsfan27 said:

The facilities are not the problem in basketball it’s the coaching. Football has been in dire need for the IPF for years and is finally getting it. The OCS would also help but it would be a short term fix at best if we keep producing teams with only 1-4 wins so at some point coaches have to establish a program that goes bowling every year and wins a few conference championships if we want to get the most out of an ocs

The stadium is NOT the problem in Football either.  USF plays in an NFL caliber stadium where the SUPER BOWL was played last year.  I personally know former players (2 now in the NFL) who LOVED playing at RayJay.  Honestly, for a college prospect name ONE stadium in the AAC that is better than RayJay.  A small stadium on campus WILL be a step down.  If USF had Cincinattii's team and record this year we'd have been selling tickets in the 3rd level at RayJay, I guarantee it. 

7 hours ago, Cubanbull said:

Agree. The two situations are different. For many years USF’s facilities were below par and that has to be fixed. In football an OCS and IPF were needed in order to compete and attract coaches and players. Basketball has good enough facilities to compete and is failing and there doesn’t seem to be a change under current leadership. 

The situations are not different.  How would things have been different with Coach Strong if we were sitting in a new stadium watching that crap?  How would they be different today if we were sitting in a new stadium watching the SS that has been the past two years?  I could be sitting in the Taj Mahal and if Gregory is still coaching next year I"m out. Same could be said for football.  It's expensive, time consuming and HOT to go watch college football in Florida in the fall.  The team's record matters more than everything else COMBINED regardless of whether it's FB or MBB.

7 hours ago, Friscobull said:

Agree with the MBB analogy, disagree vehemently with the stadium take.  This is exactly what is needed to make this University relevant and less a commuter school.  The University will prosper and flourish as we perform tours and Saturday is buzzing with activity.  Would be nice if we started to win more than a game or two a year though.

Seriously?  Are you kidding me?  "The university will prosper and flourish as we perform tours and Saturday is buzzing with activity"?

You must first ask yourself "How many people do we lose when we move from RayJay to USF because they dont want to make the drive?"  It's more than you think.  Then ask yourself "How many more people will show up for this $h1t Show just because we have a pretty new stadium on campus?"  It ain't as many as you think.

USF must fix the product they are selling FB and MBB before worrying about new facilities.  There are A LOT of schools with better facilities that look like ghost towns because their product sucks too.  Why would USF be any different?  Oh I forgot, because it's USF.

Would a new showroom have saved Yugo?  Or FIAT? Or (insert failing / failed car brand with crap for product here) in this country?  No.

SO just how many more people do think will show up just because they build a new stadium on campus?  And how long do you think they will put up with this crap?