TallyBull

I don't think it reaches 4 conferences of 16 teams. I think it will be 5 conferences. I don't think the PAC or Big 12 will grow to 16. I think it will end up 5 conferences with about 70-76 teams total.

Edit, being the PAC, BIG, big12, SEC and reformed ACC/Big East.

I just don't see universities with very large entolwnta and in huge media markets like Houston, USF and UCF being left out.

I agree, I think this is the most likely scenario. I can understand the pessimism, but I'm not quite there yet.

Also, the Big 10 loves AAU schools. Is there a benefit to that? Or is that just another preference? We lost Pitt and gained Tulane. I would presume this isn't factoring in at all since we picked Houston over Rice.

Academics has nothing to do with who the Big East is adding. I think they are looking at Market size, fan base, and potential to grow (massive undergrad enrollment See UCF and Houston).

Correct. And it's the best (perhaps only) card the Big East has to play, since it can't hang its hat on "traditional" or "name brand" teams in football. If we don't somehow get into the ACC I'm still optimistic USF can be successful in the new Big East.

I agree with the general tone of the argument. But it's quite funny how Fennelly gets lambasted when he writes something negative about the school/team that doesn't involve Holtz. He's dead wrong about football being the driving force. I offer Pitt and Cuse as perfect examples.

+1

His suggestion that UofL's football success is why the ACC chose it is also wrong. Yes, they won the BE last night. But I'm pretty confident it was UofL's basketball that was the deciding factor, plus a decent (but not great) football team.

Also, I'm calling BS on the whole "keeping UCF out" argument. Seems clear to me USF didn't try hard enough, if it tried at all. At the end, USF nominally supported the move (probably because it didn't have the votes to keep UCF out). But Fennelly doesn't criticize FSU or UM for blackballing us from the SEC and ACC (the underlying rationale seems to be, "well OF COURSE they'd keep USF out"), while telling us that karma is a b*itch because of our not wanting UCF to join the BE. In light of FSU and UM's positions, isn't it SMALL TIME for them to blackball us? Which is it, Fennelly?

Talk about small time. The MEDIA in this market (Greg Auman excepted) is SMALL TIME. I sometimes try to listen to Justin Pawlawski at lunch time on 98.7 but Gary Shelton is virtually unlistenable. He comes across as a grandpa who's watched a lot of football in his day but doesn't really know anything about USF and would just as much rather see USF fall off the face of the earth so he doesn't have to catch up or talk about them. That's my impression anyways.

ACC is doomed. It will fill with all of the former big east teams. Big east will fill with all of the former CUSA teams.

Wonder how this will affect the ACC-ESPN contract.

You're right, but I'd rather be on that sinking ship than this one. This one's taking on water MUCH faster.

http://www.eersautho...2-makes-a-push/

"Sources at Ohio State University tell me that GT has already applied to the Big 10 and received an offer. If that’s true I would expect GT to decide shortly after the ACC championship game."

If this becomes true, then who is program #16? I don't think getting GT would sway ND to the B1G.

It'll probably be NC... Just a guess.

It really is tough reading this board anymore. To those of you that really believe Skip doesn't care about winning just don't know the guy. This has been tough on him and his family. I'm not crazy about some of his coaching decisions (or lack thereof) and all the losing, but this is not something the man wants. My wife and I went over to talk to his wife at the L'ville game and the poor woman is just totally distraught over this as is Skip. Trust me. They care. That doesn't mean he is getting the job done and deserves to stay but meet the man and his family and there is no way you "boo" the man. You can boo the decisions made during the game but just don't think the man deserves being booed at his radio show. Just like the kids on the field. I just won't boo a college athlete, either team. Just my .

+1

I'm torn about it because I can understand either decision, keep him or let him go, and I do believe he cares. We'll have to just see what happens; glad I don't have to make the final decision. If he stays though they need to make changes in defensive coaching.

Aside from this board, the consensus is if FSU leaves, Uconn and Cincy are still ahead of us. We're still #3 or #4 in line. Navy could actually jump us according to some sources out there.

I agree. While theman123 is correct, the Big 12 is not open to us-I suspect would rather even collapse than add us with a net profit per member, the ACC does not even have the theoretical desire to add us. There is a good chance we would be rejected even if FSU left. They probably think Miami is enough in Florida.

Doom and gloom reigns supreme on this board.

If UVA/NC/FSU/CU all leave - certainly possible if Swaim is correct - then we're in. After Cincy, UCONN, Navy, and USF, who's left to add to get back to 14? Tulane?

Keep hope alive!

Aside from this board, the consensus is if FSU leaves, Uconn and Cincy are still ahead of us. We're still #3 or #4 in line. Navy could actually jump us according to some sources out there.

consensus (outside this board and on it) was that UCONN would go before UofL, and obviously that was wrong. also I'm not sure that Cincy goes before us because UofL is only two hours away so there's at least an argument that ACC already has that market (and it's all about markets).

UCONN is having academic issues and Calhoun is gone, and football isn't better than ours. Navy is a decent add TV-wise, but not competitive in football or basketball. Finally, even if the move is GT and UVA/NC to B1G you better believe FSU and Clemson will also go to B12.

My point: there are any number of angles to all of this that could work out for USF. We need chaos, and this would help if it happens.

While none came right out, had all the earmarks of #GT. Could see either #UVa or #UNC as the other for 16.

— GREG SWAIM SHOW (@GSwaim)

November 30, 2012

Believe it if you want but Swaim says two more ACC teams will be gone in 7-10 days

I've seen some of the comments on the Facebook page over the course of the year.

After BJ's injury they had a couple fluff pieces on his recovery and his yardage records and there were our "fans" posting that he was a loser, and that they were glad he was injured so we could move on. Every single post over the last 2 months contains negative commentary from the "fans", even the innocuous USF posts with photographs of the team practicing.

I think people should voice their opinions and I think Skip needs to go, but trashing he team on their page is not the right way to go about it. At all.

+1

id much prefer a SSS downtown than the rays

Says all 1 of you.

+1

Louisville is proof of what a great AD can do. Read the Pat Forde article on Yahoo sports I believe.

I'd love to have a guy heading our athletic department with even half the "cojones" of Tom Jurich.

He may need to pull another one out of the hat ... Heard this morning that Auburn was talking to Strong.

I'm not sure if it was Auburn or another SEC school that passed on Strong initially because he's married to a caucasian woman. To the boosters at some of those schools, interracial marriage is still considered a bit of a taboo. Maybe Auburn's dire straits will cause some of their boosters to reevaluate their stances on interracial relationships, who knows.

Sad that has anything to do with anything.

http://www2.tbo.com/...400m-ar-578282/

Mitchell's group has invited local political and business leaders to the Tampa Club, atop the Bank of America building downtown, for the official unveiling of VSI Tampa's plan — a 28,888-seat stadium with a retractable roof, a $50 million soccer academy and a $250 million sports medicine center.

^^ Maybe we need to get in on this deal and split a 50-50 deal with them for this stadium

Soccer is NEVER going to take off in this nation... let alone in Tampa.

Its obvious that these people must be working for the Joker since they have money to burn on this crap. They also must not understand how to read because RayJay was built to accommodate major league soccer.

With that said, since these people are obviously fools USF should approach them and see if they will build it on our campus so our soccer team can benefit from it, and make it so that the stadium can be easily changed over for real football. would be a cheap and easy way to get an OCS for football.

Of course we would need more then 28K in seating... I think 40K should do the trick.

How do you even function sometimes?

1. WE HAVE A SOCCER SPECIFIC STADIUM ON CAMPUS THAT IS PERFECT FOR WHAT WE NEED. It's considered one of the best in the country.

2. I have some people in Portland, Seattle and New York that you need to talk to. If you don't think an MLS team can succeed here with the right setup you're uneducated or delusional.

1. We do have a soccer stadium on campus, but imagine having this thing on campus vs. the small one we have. Which one would be better in the long run? Also like TallyBull stated Nova nearly worked out a similar deal with Philly's MLS soccer team to play in their stadium, the deal feel through because it did not have enough seats. If Doug and Judy were to work something out with this group, and assuming they have funding to the 28K stadium, then I'm sure that USF could pony up the other half for a 40K seat expansion and bam we would have an OCS. But if they don't want to share their facility then that is there prerogative.

2. You made my point for me by bringing up New York, Seattle, and Portland. Tampa is a quasi-southern town and soccer has been tried here before and has failed every single time.

My point exactly. Why is it some folks on the board think that even talking about the possibility is a bad idea? If it doesn't work for both sides (due to the need for a SSS, or another location, or funding arrangements, etc.), fine. But at least you explored the possibility.

I really wish people would read the article and visit their website before forming an opinion.

1. The new stadium will only be a soccer specific stadium. MLS has made it clear that any expansion franchise will have to have a SSS. If you look at the recent stadiums and expansion franchises for the MLS this is quite evident.

2. The SSS they are designing starts at 28k for the pro team... it's also being build to be expandable to 40k+ if they can secure a MLS expansion.

USF will not be playing in this stadium.

Dude, this is USF Bulls board for crying out loud, not an appellate argument. I haven't researched every angle. Don't have time for that, unlike you (apparently). But conceptually it makes more sense to share such large facilities that sit unused for most of the year. Soccer would occur in the summer, CFB in the fall. If that's MLS' position that it MUST be a SSS, fair enough, but I remember last year lots of talk about Villanova possibly sharing a new stadium with the Philly soccer team. If MLS doesn't allow, as a matter of practice, shared use of their stadiums, then why would that even be a possibility? More likely there's greater flexibility than you suggest (based upon your online research of their web site).

Seems like they would be better off leasing Ray Jay. Most of the other MLS teams share an NFL stadium because they're only used a few times per year.

If you read the article, they say that won't work because no one wants to play in a half empty stadium. (Same is true with respect to USF, IMHO.)

I doubt the 28K size is set in stone; details are always negotiable when a partnership is in play.

If it is a retractable roof stadium, I don't see how the 28K size wouldn't be set in stone

It's not built yet. The designs can be amended so that the retractable roof fits. Perhaps at somewhat greater cost, but that's what a public/private partnership could resolve.

Getting rid of Holtz doesn't mean there is a better replacement just waiting to come to the most unstable, no longer BCS, conference in football.

Status quo isn't working though. I'm on the fence regarding whether he should go this year or next year, more for logistical reasons than for any hope that the team might improve next year (although I'd be fine with that result; I don't care about CSH's nice guy "attitidude" so long as the team wins). But there's always someone out there who'd coach a Florida FBS football team.

nobody gives a $h!t about soccer in the United States, when are these people going to get that?

And while I agree RayJ's 67k is presently too much for us, 28k is way too small.

With respect to American interest in soccer, their willingness to invest in this project suggests otherwise. Particularly since the stadium would be tailored to what they believe is sustainable.

As for a collaboration, I posted earlier in another thread that it would be wise for USF and this investment group to at least talk about the possiblity. I doubt the 28K size is set in stone; details are always negotiable when a partnership is in play.

Sorry... last post on this (don't want or mean to hijack the thread). But I saw this in today's paper:

http://www2.tbo.com/news/sports/2012/nov/28/10/major-league-soccer-may-return-to-tampa-with-400m-ar-578282/

Obviously, a 28,000-seat stadium would be too small for our needs. But it would be great if we could form some kind of public/private partnership with these folks for an OCS. Imagine a 40,000-seat retractable-roof OCS... both team's colors could be green and gold... ah, to dream.

let me get this straight -- some have claimed we can't afford to buy out of Holtz current contract

yet we have people on here thinking THIS is an ideal time to go forward with building an OCS?

That sounds pretty clueless to me.

Have you ever balanced a check book in your lives? Where does all this mysterious money come from when the program is clearly struggling more than it ever has in its history? Attendance is down-- let's build a stadium-- yeah-- that will get the fans to come back in droves. They won't mind losing anymore if we do that. Yeah-- embrace that suck

I didn't get the impression anyone was meaning we should be pushing for this now, just that it would be nice to have one and to have the means to build one.

we could be killing it on the football field and still be just as unlikely to be building anything on campus any time soon.

SIX OR SEVEN GAMES PEOPLE--- rent, do not buy

The problem is that we have a huge supply that damages demand. Not saying we need to build a stadium, but there's little incentive to buy season tickets when you can walk up and get tickets anywhere and slide down to unused seats. I know you don't see things that way Mike, but a lot of casual fans have no incentive to buy season tickets because of the supply.

Exactly right. And let's be honest, there was plenty of supply at RJS even when we were winning regularly and highly ranked, so to suggest we need RJS's extra capacity is just wrong. We rarely do and when we don't it kills the game day atmosphere (aside from the big pirate ship and red seats).

let me get this straight -- some have claimed we can't afford to buy out of Holtz current contract

yet we have people on here thinking THIS is an ideal time to go forward with building an OCS?

That sounds pretty clueless to me.

Have you ever balanced a check book in your lives? Where does all this mysterious money come from when the program is clearly struggling more than it ever has in its history? Attendance is down-- let's build a stadium-- yeah-- that will get the fans to come back in droves. They won't mind losing anymore if we do that. Yeah-- embrace that suck

I didn't get the impression anyone was meaning we should be pushing for this now, just that it would be nice to have one and to have the means to build one.

we could be killing it on the football field and still be just as unlikely to be building anything on campus any time soon.

SIX OR SEVEN GAMES PEOPLE--- rent, do not buy

People who rent often die poor. INVEST in your team financially and fans and alums will invest emotionally.

Renter's mentality is a loser's mentality, as reflected in our half-empty pirate stadium. This isn't UF or even FSU and won't be for a generation because the fan base isn't there. Build an OCS that is more appropriate for our fan base now and can be expanded to meet our needs in the future. If we anticipate a big game then we can rent RJS for that one game but most games should be on campus.

let me get this straight -- some have claimed we can't afford to buy out of Holtz current contract

yet we have people on here thinking THIS is an ideal time to go forward with building an OCS?

That sounds pretty clueless to me.

Have you ever balanced a check book in your lives? Where does all this mysterious money come from when the program is clearly struggling more than it ever has in its history? Attendance is down-- let's build a stadium-- yeah-- that will get the fans to come back in droves. They won't mind losing anymore if we do that. Yeah-- embrace that suck

I didn't get the impression anyone was meaning we should be pushing for this now, just that it would be nice to have one and to have the means to build one.

+1

Didn't mean build one IMMEDIATELY, just have a PLAN to build one in the FUTURE that your alums can RALLY BEHIND, particularly when the on field product is mediocre. MAKE THE CASE that as a point of pride USF will build a better but affordable stadium on campus than UCF's.

USF needs to win and continue with their plans (My only fear is they do not have any), Cancelling season tickets is the worst thing we can all do, I know its easier said then done but we have to stay the course. USF still has tremendous, off the chart potential for growth, and come the next chance we need to be in a position to take the call. We are in the 13th largest media market, and our a top 10 univesity in terms of enrollment, the potential for fans is clearly here. Judy has also done a great job improving academics and securing research dollars, if she can somehow improve the 6 year graduation rate then we will be as good a candidate as anyone for the AAU.

Administration needs to continue to support the program, they have showed commitment by updating the other sports facilities but now its time to lay the football plans in place. Its football thats driving this whole show, I for one would feel a lot more confidence if I knew there was a 5-10 year plan.

Now that our stadium doesn't have to match Minnesota's, since we're no longer one of the big boys, can we lay down plans for a 40K expandable OCS?

Great idea ... let's run off the majority of the season ticket holders that will still be around.

Why would a new OCS run off season ticket holders? Are there really USF fans that only go to games because they're at RJS? If so, who are these people?

A large amount of our fans are not your typical college football fans ... born and raised on the high school stadiums on steroids that most college stadiums are. You try to pass off a POS like the BHNFP on them and it'll be thanks but no thanks, especially with the perceived backward movement of the program.

Funny, because I graduated from Florida and now live in Tallahassee. Never heard any college football fan at UF or FSU complain about the bleachers in those stadiums, but I've heard A LOT of complaints from fans at USF games about the lack of collegiate atmosphere at RJS. I also had Bucs season tickets from 1998-2008. RJS is a great NFL venue but not a great venue for the vast majority of USF games when there are only about 35K-40K in the stands. Those games would have a completely different atmosphere if they were on campus in an expandable 40K-50K OCS stadium, even if it had bleachers like at UF and FSU. Also, in light of the conference situation (if it sticks), a smaller venue would seem to be more appropriate in the future. Just MHO.

We better assume that UConn and Cincinnati would replace FSU and Clemson. I will say it again, we need the Big 12 and ACC to move to 28 teams in the aggregate in order to get in. I am afraid if they go to 26 we will be #27 and be left on the outside.

24 and counting.

UofL and Cincy are about two hours apart. ACC got Cincy's market when it got UofL. The next two adds (if they ever occur) will be UCONN and either USF or Navy. Cincy's done and they know it, which is why they lobbied so hard. And, in light of BC's open hostility to UCONN, it could even be Navy and USF. I think the reason got any consideration at all was due to this UCONN/BC dynamic.

Wish I shared your confidence, but if uc isn't interesting to acc because of ville and uconn isn't interesting because of BC, what makes us a better option given um and fsu?

We only get a serious look if FSU is gone. Our best chance is if both are gone.

USF needs to win and continue with their plans (My only fear is they do not have any), Cancelling season tickets is the worst thing we can all do, I know its easier said then done but we have to stay the course. USF still has tremendous, off the chart potential for growth, and come the next chance we need to be in a position to take the call. We are in the 13th largest media market, and our a top 10 univesity in terms of enrollment, the potential for fans is clearly here. Judy has also done a great job improving academics and securing research dollars, if she can somehow improve the 6 year graduation rate then we will be as good a candidate as anyone for the AAU.

Administration needs to continue to support the program, they have showed commitment by updating the other sports facilities but now its time to lay the football plans in place. Its football thats driving this whole show, I for one would feel a lot more confidence if I knew there was a 5-10 year plan.

Now that our stadium doesn't have to match Minnesota's, since we're no longer one of the big boys, can we lay down plans for a 40K expandable OCS?

Great idea ... let's run off the majority of the season ticket holders that will still be around.

Why would a new OCS run off season ticket holders? Are there really USF fans that only go to games because they're at RJS? If so, who are these people?