Big East Expansion Thread

[Dogma]

The conference needs to be proactive rather than reactive so I hope this is true.  There is also chatter out there that the Big 10 isn't looking to expand and is happy at 12 if that is true I think the ACC will get hit hard by the SEC if they choose to get to 16.  The Big East could really come out in a great position after all of this. 

:2cents

Not really... if the ACC gets hit hard then the ACC will come and poach our teams, basketball is not enough to keep football schools happy, this was apparent back when Miami, VT, and BC flew the coup for the ACC. If I remember correctly both WV and Pitt wanted to go to the ACC as well but were turned away because the ACC wanted Miami, VT, and BC, which at the time was the cream of the Big East.

If the ACC gets hit they will turn around and raid the Big Easy, namely WV in the event the SEC stays at 14 teams, or in the case of the SEC going to 16 teams the ACC will likely be looking to poach enough teams to keep pace with the SEC... If the SEC goes to 16 teams then they will take 3 from the ACC thus leaving them with only 9... that means that they would need to poach 7 teams to reach the 16 mark. If the ACC takes 7 teams from the Big East there won't be much of anything left to keep the conference alive... the only hope for the remnants of the Big Easy and the Lil 12 would be to join together and try to create a 5th super conference, but in order for this to occur the Big East would need to split with the basketball only schools.

In any event the fate of 16 team super conference expansion rests with the PAC... if they can take OU,OSU,TT, and UT then they will be the first to hit 16 teams. Once this happens all of the other big conferences (big according to ESPN) will follow suit, i.e. SEC, B1G, ACC. The only reason why the SEC has not announced any plans to find a 14th team is because they are waiting to see what the PAC does. If they go to 16 teams then the SEC will follow suit... if the PAC fails because UT won't play nice then I think everyone will sit at 14 teams for a while.

IF the big conferences remain at 14 teams for a while then I can see the Big Easy having a chance to stay alive. If the PAC just moves to 14 teams then I can see the SEC adding Mizzou to wrap up the footprint of the South, minus Virginia of course, and waiting to for the next round of expansion.

However even at 14 teams I can see the B1G taking Iowa State because they already have Iowa in their conference, and one Big East team... most likely either Cuse or Rutgers.

The Big Easy would need to take Kansas, K-State, and Baylor to reach 11... if the Big Easy wanted to reach 14 then they would just need to add UCF  :throwup2 and two other C-USA teams to reach the 14 mark to remain competitive.

I think if that happens.. you will see the BEast poach ACC, not the other way around

Say you have the SEC take V. Tech, FL State, and Clemson (3 teams as you mentioned.)

Miami is about to be hit hard with sanctions

.. How is the ACC a better option team for team than the BEast?

Are you telling me Duke, Wake Forest, Maryland, BC, Miami (under heavy multi-year sanctions,) NC State, N Carolina, GTech, and Virginia a better catch and lure 7 of the now 9 BEast teams?

Big East + TCU + Kansas, K State, Iowa, Mizzou can surely lure Maryland, BC, and a Carolina school... if not ECU to make it 16

[Apis Bull]

I assume you mean Iowa State.  If we go to 12, I'd like Kansas, Missouri, and Houston/Baylor.  16, I'd like Kansas, Missouri, Houston/Baylor, the three ACC defectors (Miami, BC, VaTech), and Maryland.

[macphisto]

:2cents

Not really... if the ACC gets hit hard then the ACC will come and poach our teams, basketball is not enough to keep football schools happy, this was apparent back when Miami, VT, and BC flew the coup for the ACC. If I remember correctly both WV and Pitt wanted to go to the ACC as well but were turned away because the ACC wanted Miami, VT, and BC, which at the time was the cream of the Big East.

If the ACC gets hit they will turn around and raid the Big Easy, namely WV in the event the SEC stays at 14 teams, or in the case of the SEC going to 16 teams the ACC will likely be looking to poach enough teams to keep pace with the SEC... If the SEC goes to 16 teams then they will take 3 from the ACC thus leaving them with only 9... that means that they would need to poach 7 teams to reach the 16 mark. If the ACC takes 7 teams from the Big East there won't be much of anything left to keep the conference alive... the only hope for the remnants of the Big Easy and the Lil 12 would be to join together and try to create a 5th super conference, but in order for this to occur the Big East would need to split with the basketball only schools.

Big East teams have no incentive to go to the ACC right now.  That conference is locked into a 12 year contract where each team gets around $12M a year.  The upcoming Big East deal is likely to be at least $3M more per year than that and possibly more.  ACC teams moving to the Big East have more incentive since the BE needs to negotiate a new TV deal while the ACC looks to be near the bottom in TV revenue for another decade. 

Unless the other conferences have triggers that base their pay on how many teams are in the conference or are able to renegotiate the deals (and a network would not do that unless the contract calls for it), then those conferences will dilute the per team payout by adding teams.  The SEC, ACC, and Pac-12 are all locked in for over a decade.  We're most likely to go the way of the Big Ten and have our own network coupled with a national contract on top of it. 

In short, the Big East is best set up to negotiate a bigger contract based on a 16 team conference.  The ACC is not.  If the ACC is paying $3-6 million less per year in TV revenue, why would you leave if you're WVU?  And if you're a leftover ACC team, why would you stay if you can get an additional $3-6M per year by going to the Big East?

If this had happened a few years ago, the Big East would have been hosed.  The conference is in a stronger position right now and it already has the largest demographic footprint.  Adding several ACC teams would just expand that - and the conference has the best "in" to the New York City market as well.  Teaming up with the Yankees for a bowl game was wise as that could lead to future deals with a media giant. 

[macphisto]

I think if that happens.. you will see the BEast poach ACC, not the other way around

Say you have the SEC take V. Tech, FL State, and Clemson (3 teams as you mentioned.)

Miami is about to be hit hard with sanctions

.. How is the ACC a better option team for team than the BEast?

Are you telling me Duke, Wake Forest, Maryland, BC, Miami (under heavy multi-year sanctions,) NC State, N Carolina, GTech, and Virginia a better catch and lure 7 of the now 9 BEast teams?

I'm very doubtful that the SEC would invite Florida State or Clemson.  The agreements between the teams in the conference would make it difficult for that to happen.  They'd first look to expand their footprint beyond their current boundaries.  The Virginia and North Carolina teams would be their main targets.  They already think they're strong enough football wise, so they'd be willing t absorb more mediocre teams that would give them access to more media markets.  UNC and NC State would give them Raleigh, for instance.  Virginia would give them best access into Richmond and Norfolk. 

Besides, I'm not sure FSU would be interested in the SEC just like I'm not sure a team like West Virginia would be interested if the SEC or Big Ten came calling.  In the Big East these teams have a chance to be the big kids on the block.  FSU would be just another good team from Florida in the SEC.  West Virginia would be diminished in either conference.

I think if there is massive expansion and the ACC dissolves that FSU will end up in the Big East along with Georgia Tech and Clemson.

[Buller64]

:2cents

Not really... if the ACC gets hit hard then the ACC will come and poach our teams, basketball is not enough to keep football schools happy, this was apparent back when Miami, VT, and BC flew the coup for the ACC. If I remember correctly both WV and Pitt wanted to go to the ACC as well but were turned away because the ACC wanted Miami, VT, and BC, which at the time was the cream of the Big East.

At that time the ACC contract was 3x more than the BE contract and was a more highly respected conference for both FB and BB. Things have changed since the early 200s and the BE is looking at a much better contract.

If the ACC gets hit they will turn around and raid the Big Easy, namely WV in the event the SEC stays at 14 teams, or in the case of the SEC going to 16 teams the ACC will likely be looking to poach enough teams to keep pace with the SEC... If the SEC goes to 16 teams then they will take 3 from the ACC thus leaving them with only 9... that means that they would need to poach 7 teams to reach the 16 mark. If the ACC takes 7 teams from the Big East there won't be much of anything left to keep the conference alive... the only hope for the remnants of the Big Easy and the Lil 12 would be to join together and try to create a 5th super conference, but in order for this to occur the Big East would need to split with the basketball only schools.

Don't be so sure about poaching the BE. There are two other potential BCS schools in ACC territory (UCF and ECU). The loss of a couple of teams such as Clemson and FSU may cause the TV to be renegotitated (I'm sure there is a renegotiate clause in the contract). Since the BE hasn't got a new contract yet teams may take a wait and see approach. This is particularly true if the BE can poach Mizzou and Kansas (adding KC and St Louis to the TV market). If that occurs the BE ends up with a contract larger than the PAC 12 currently has but less than what the SEC currently has. In addition, Duke and NC weren't happy about going to 12 schools, they are still not happy with it so the ACC may not expand.

In any event the fate of 16 team super conference expansion rests with the PAC... if they can take OU,OSU,TT, and UT then they will be the first to hit 16 teams. Once this happens all of the other big conferences (big according to ESPN) will follow suit, i.e. SEC, B1G, ACC. The only reason why the SEC has not announced any plans to find a 14th team is because they are waiting to see what the PAC does. If they go to 16 teams then the SEC will follow suit... if the PAC fails because UT won't play nice then I think everyone will sit at 14 teams for a while.

IF the big conferences remain at 14 teams for a while then I can see the Big Easy having a chance to stay alive. If the PAC just moves to 14 teams then I can see the SEC adding Mizzou to wrap up the footprint of the South, minus Virginia of course, and waiting to for the next round of expansion.

However even at 14 teams I can see the B1G taking Iowa State because they already have Iowa in their conference, and one Big East team... most likely either Cuse or Rutgers.

The Big Easy would need to take Kansas, K-State, and Baylor to reach 11... if the Big Easy wanted to reach 14 then they would just need to add UCF  :throwup2 and two other C-USA teams to reach the 14 mark to remain competitive.

It is also possible that the BE can poach from the ACC VT and BC were BE schools and Maryland would be receptive if the BE got a bigger TV contract. The BE commish turning down the ESPN proposed contract is looking big now. It gives the BE much more bargaining room for teams and perhaps a much better contract after the dust settles. remember the Be is still contracted for the 2012-13 seasons too so there is no real hurry in getting one done.

[mikemcp88]

BE needs to be proactive and go after the B12 teams ASAP. I would also be fine with Baylor who continues to improve. I would really like the BE to stay intact and get stronger. They gave us the opportunity to be in s BCS conference.

[DELdaBull]

I assume you mean Iowa State.  If we go to 12, I'd like Kansas, Missouri, and Houston/Baylor.  16, I'd like Kansas, Missouri, Houston/Baylor, the three ACC defectors (Miami, BC, VaTech), and Maryland.

Don't forget Kansas State

[tampabull]

if the pac 12 goes to 16....

sec adds tamu and mizzou, nobody else really out there in new markets.  stay at 14

big east adds kansas, kstate, baylor stays at 12.  maybe iowa state and houston to get to 14.  but houston and baylor share market places.

big 10 will hold and reevaluate at a later date like they said.  they want to see how much more nebraska brings before going crazy.  if they do decide to expand it will be maryland(not rutgers)  they will go after and maybe unc.  remember they only want big splashes in new markets.  outside shot big 10 tries to get fsu.  really doesn't fit what they were going after in the first place but it would be a big splash.  nd will follow in a scenario where big 10 expands.  the 16th team will be up in the air.  

big 12 will fold

mountain west might be able to grab houston and iowa state if big east stays at 12.

[tampabull]

the thing people forget about baylor they actually have a good athletics program.  it's there football team that has struggled.  plus they bring a lot academically.

[Apis Bull]

I assume you mean Iowa State.  If we go to 12, I'd like Kansas, Missouri, and Houston/Baylor.  16, I'd like Kansas, Missouri, Houston/Baylor, the three ACC defectors (Miami, BC, VaTech), and Maryland.

Don't forget Kansas State

Not high on K-State and would only take them if they and Kansas were a package deal.