USF can not afford the luxury of reshirting Gunsby

[nobull.Bulls]

No point in using Gunsby now. Gotta let the rest of the season play out as is. Dont waste a good year 4 years down the road on a bad one today

[Bull Martin]

As I said in another similar thread.  Holtz is redshirting Gunsby and playing a true freshman walk-on, even though Gunsby is better, because Gunsby is the future at that position?  How does that even make sense?

Holtz isn't playing Eveld, he is playing BJ.  Eveld is just a place holder on the 2-deep to buy time for Gunsby to groom.

Place holder?  You can read the coach's mind?  By the way, Gunsby is so much the future they have committed for next season 2 QBs and are still recruiting Jacoby Brisset.

That's what I believe based on the circumstances with which Gunsby/Eveld were acquired by USF.  I didn’t say Gunsby was a guarantee; just that he is the best option for the future out of the current candidates.  Because he is no guarantee, naturally, you wouldn’t just stop recruiting QBs.

If Gunsby is truly the future it makes more sense to red shirt him this season than give him garbage minutes.  He's not going to beat out BJ this year.  Holtz and Fitch are committed to BJ.  Gunsby will have plenty of opportunity to get garbage minutes next season.  A true freshman will look just as confused as BJ out there with this receiving core and pass protection.

If we are going to lose with either QB, I say lose with Gunsby.  I don't see them as garbage minutes; I see them as time on the job training if he is playing while the game is still winnable.  I’d like to avoid as much garbage time as possible next year.  I’m sure he would look as confused as BJ, but at least he would gain experience to build on during a loss that we'll apparently suffer either way.  Heck, there’s an outside chance he’d execute.

But if he's not really going to play any better (which is what the coaches think from watching practice and red shirting him), then it's better to give him time to learn the system before throwing him into the fire.  He's a freshman, he's got a whole lot to learn text book wise in the college game.  No sense in burning a year of eligibility for no better results on the field.  He can pick up the minutes next year if BJ is still struggling and then have 3 more years of eligibility to go instead of 2.

Gunsby was a bit of a reach as a recruit.  He was an unevaluated player that came from virtually no where at the last minute when Skip pulled Carnes scholarship.  Gunsby was picked up for depth.  If he becomes the starting QB at USF it's added bonus, but it's not why he's here.

You don't think that he will progress faster with real playing time than he would with only practice? 

I'm saying we can't afford to be greedy and try to get 4 whole years out of him.  The severity of our immediate problem won't allow for it.  The result on the field this year might not be any better, but he could hit the ground running next year.  I see sense in burning the redshirt.  This is all hands on deck...ship is sinking.  We'll find another QB for 2014.

And he may be what you say he is, but I don't see why you would want to preserve his redshirt with as dire as things are at QB right now.

I don't care either way if Gunsby is red shirted or not.  I just have to take the position that the coaches who watch the practices know what they're doing.

Panicky decisions based on fan pressure is not something I ever want to see in a head football coach.  If BJ is the best option then we keep him in.  If Gunsby is the best option, then we need to burn his red shirt and get him ready.  I don't know the answer, but I'm going to trust the coaches' decision.

[8u11`o3]

As I said in another similar thread.  Holtz is redshirting Gunsby and playing a true freshman walk-on, even though Gunsby is better, because Gunsby is the future at that position?  How does that even make sense?

Holtz isn't playing Eveld, he is playing BJ.  Eveld is just a place holder on the 2-deep to buy time for Gunsby to groom.

Place holder?  You can read the coach's mind?  By the way, Gunsby is so much the future they have committed for next season 2 QBs and are still recruiting Jacoby Brisset.

That's what I believe based on the circumstances with which Gunsby/Eveld were acquired by USF.  I didn’t say Gunsby was a guarantee; just that he is the best option for the future out of the current candidates.  Because he is no guarantee, naturally, you wouldn’t just stop recruiting QBs.

If Gunsby is truly the future it makes more sense to red shirt him this season than give him garbage minutes.  He's not going to beat out BJ this year.  Holtz and Fitch are committed to BJ.  Gunsby will have plenty of opportunity to get garbage minutes next season.  A true freshman will look just as confused as BJ out there with this receiving core and pass protection.

If we are going to lose with either QB, I say lose with Gunsby.  I don't see them as garbage minutes; I see them as time on the job training if he is playing while the game is still winnable.  I’d like to avoid as much garbage time as possible next year.  I’m sure he would look as confused as BJ, but at least he would gain experience to build on during a loss that we'll apparently suffer either way.  Heck, there’s an outside chance he’d execute.

But if he's not really going to play any better (which is what the coaches think from watching practice and red shirting him), then it's better to give him time to learn the system before throwing him into the fire.  He's a freshman, he's got a whole lot to learn text book wise in the college game.  No sense in burning a year of eligibility for no better results on the field.  He can pick up the minutes next year if BJ is still struggling and then have 3 more years of eligibility to go instead of 2.

Gunsby was a bit of a reach as a recruit.  He was an unevaluated player that came from virtually no where at the last minute when Skip pulled Carnes scholarship.  Gunsby was picked up for depth.  If he becomes the starting QB at USF it's added bonus, but it's not why he's here.

You don't think that he will progress faster with real playing time than he would with only practice? 

I'm saying we can't afford to be greedy and try to get 4 whole years out of him.  The severity of our immediate problem won't allow for it.  The result on the field this year might not be any better, but he could hit the ground running next year.  I see sense in burning the redshirt.  This is all hands on deck...ship is sinking.  We'll find another QB for 2014.

And he may be what you say he is, but I don't see why you would want to preserve his redshirt with as dire as things are at QB right now.

I don't care either way if Gunsby is red shirted or not.  I just have to take the position that the coaches who watch the practices know what they're doing.

Panicky decisions based on fan pressure is not something I ever want to see in a head football coach.  If BJ is the best option then we keep him in.  If Gunsby is the best option, then we need to burn his red shirt and get him ready.  I don't know the answer, but I'm going to trust the coaches' decision.

If he takes the redshirt off of him, I wouldn't want him to do it because I or any other group of fans called for it.  I'd hope he did it because he felt the current condition was unacceptable and could be improved.

[BleedGreenAndGold]

As I said in another similar thread.  Holtz is redshirting Gunsby and playing a true freshman walk-on, even though Gunsby is better, because Gunsby is the future at that position?  How does that even make sense?

Holtz isn't playing Eveld, he is playing BJ.  Eveld is just a place holder on the 2-deep to buy time for Gunsby to groom.

Place holder?  You can read the coach's mind?  By the way, Gunsby is so much the future they have committed for next season 2 QBs and are still recruiting Jacoby Brisset.

That's what I believe based on the circumstances with which Gunsby/Eveld were acquired by USF.  I didn’t say Gunsby was a guarantee; just that he is the best option for the future out of the current candidates.  Because he is no guarantee, naturally, you wouldn’t just stop recruiting QBs.

If Gunsby is truly the future it makes more sense to red shirt him this season than give him garbage minutes.  He's not going to beat out BJ this year.  Holtz and Fitch are committed to BJ.  Gunsby will have plenty of opportunity to get garbage minutes next season.  A true freshman will look just as confused as BJ out there with this receiving core and pass protection.

If we are going to lose with either QB, I say lose with Gunsby.  I don't see them as garbage minutes; I see them as time on the job training if he is playing while the game is still winnable.  I’d like to avoid as much garbage time as possible next year.  I’m sure he would look as confused as BJ, but at least he would gain experience to build on during a loss that we'll apparently suffer either way.  Heck, there’s an outside chance he’d execute.

But if he's not really going to play any better (which is what the coaches think from watching practice and red shirting him), then it's better to give him time to learn the system before throwing him into the fire.  He's a freshman, he's got a whole lot to learn text book wise in the college game.  No sense in burning a year of eligibility for no better results on the field.  He can pick up the minutes next year if BJ is still struggling and then have 3 more years of eligibility to go instead of 2.

Gunsby was a bit of a reach as a recruit.  He was an unevaluated player that came from virtually no where at the last minute when Skip pulled Carnes scholarship.  Gunsby was picked up for depth.  If he becomes the starting QB at USF it's added bonus, but it's not why he's here.

You don't think that he will progress faster with real playing time than he would with only practice? 

I'm saying we can't afford to be greedy and try to get 4 whole years out of him.  The severity of our immediate problem won't allow for it.  The result on the field this year might not be any better, but he could hit the ground running next year.  I see sense in burning the redshirt.  This is all hands on deck...ship is sinking.  We'll find another QB for 2014.

And he may be what you say he is, but I don't see why you would want to preserve his redshirt with as dire as things are at QB right now.

I don't care either way if Gunsby is red shirted or not.  I just have to take the position that the coaches who watch the practices know what they're doing.

Panicky decisions based on fan pressure is not something I ever want to see in a head football coach.  If BJ is the best option then we keep him in.  If Gunsby is the best option, then we need to burn his red shirt and get him ready.  I don't know the answer, but I'm going to trust the coaches' decision.

If he takes the redshirt off of him, I wouldn't want him to do it because I or any other group of fans called for it.  I'd hope he did it because he felt the current condition was unacceptable and could be improved.

And that's the kicker.  I'm sure the coaches want to win as badly as the fans, probably more so.  It could very well be that Daniels really is our best option at the moment.

[deters-]

I don't like the idea of wasting his Redshirt this late in the season and would prefer to switch it up and try Eveld before coming to that. But here is my assessment of Gunsby.

I was able to make it over to Vero Beach and see Gunsby practice and play in the scrimmage and while it was against his own teammates he seemed quite legit. Gunsby was capable of making all the throws asked of him, had exceptional mobility and stayed in the pocket making throws while being rushed and hit. He is a big kid around 6'4 230lbs running a sub 4.5 or so. While watching him in live scrimmage he seemed rather calm and poised reading the field quite well and above a freshman level imo. On most of his improvised scrambling I couldn't tell if it was because of no where to throw or being quick to tuck and run, but when he did take off he gained positive yards and was a beast to bring down. It was like night and day between him and BJ in Vero. I could have sworn Daniels was the Freshman and Gunsby was the third year Soph starter.

Laugh and say what you will but I will make the statement that Gunsby reminds me of Cam Newton. He may not be as calm and cool as him (yet) but his physical presence reminds me of him on the field.

[SpartanBull]

Some of you guys really make me laugh at how you guys rip this guys thread like it is so far out of question. 

Lets think about this. 

In your guys opinion will B.J. be the QB for USF 2 years from now?  You could say maybe, but it would totally fly in the face of Holtz and his system (unless Holtz totally changes his pro style offense and allows for spread and option; and B.J. somehow magically gets his head together).

IMO Gunsby was brought in to be the future QB for USF.

Let's say hypothetically Gunsby is the future QB for USF.  Don't you think it would be beneficial for him and for the state of the program that he start say the last 4 or 5 games to get some experience rather than start opening day at Notre Dame (this is a hypothetical situation considering B.J. is allowed the rest of the year and Holtz decides to pull B.J. going into next year)?

The reason it would be beneficial IMO is the fact that we are losing Dontavia Bogan, and A.J. Love next year meaning we will not have experienced WR's to help out Gunsby (besides really Landi and Griffin); Also we will be losing Center Sampson Genus and Mo Plancher guys that have been around that can help keep a young QB calm.

I, like one of the posters, saw Gunsby with this team in practice, and the guy looks like the perfect person for what Skip would be looking for to run his offense (obviously need to see Weatherford and Brisset).  I highly doubt Gunsby was beat out over Eveld.  Many teams redshirt their future QB so he can learn the offense and get time to mature.  I am with many on here that think it is stupid to pull a redshirt mid season, I just feel it would be more beneficial for Gunsby to play some this year considering the lack of depth we will have at WR next year (not that this year is extremely deep).

Skip seems like a smart guy, so we will have to trust him (like many have stated).  It just sucks to think that this team is looking at a couple of years (instead of next year) to get its act together.  Hopefully the wait for Holtz to get his team together will be worth it (and not like the Kragthorpe experiment).

[Bull Dozer]

If Gunsby or one of the incoming early enrollees are a better fit in the system things will work themselves out in the Spring/Summer.  People act like only good things can from from getting Gunz on the field but just as easily it could stunt his development or hurt his confidence.  Stick with BJ and let the best player win during the Spring/Summer/Fall Camp. 

[Orlando Bull]

If Gunsby or one of the incoming early enrollees are a better fit in the system things will work themselves out in the Spring/Summer.  People act like only good things can from from getting Gunz on the field but just as easily it could stunt his development or hurt his confidence.  Stick with BJ and let the best player win during the Spring/Summer/Fall Camp. 

I don't buy this at all, it sounds like an excuse that failures made up to say why they failed. The truly great ones want to be on the field, no matter what. The can get their face kicked in on one play, and they want to get right back out there and kick some ass on the next play. If a guy's got it, he's got it.

I keep going back to this, but... MG's game against Cincy in 2007 is a game where, though he sucked, and we lost, I knew that Matt Grothe had "it". He never quit fighting and put his team back in the game. BJ doesn't have that ability it seems.

I don't know if Gunsby is the guy or not, but, I think he's the best fit that we have. You watch his highlights, and he has some touch, and anticipation with his receivers. He's also athletic enough to do some things with his legs. I am with others... I can tolerate a bad season this year with QB excuses. I can't do it again next year, whether it is BJ, or "he doesn't have any experience". Skip has to do anything and everything possible to fix this situation now. The program can't withstand 3-4 years of 4-win seasons.

[Bull Dozer]

If Gunsby or one of the incoming early enrollees are a better fit in the system things will work themselves out in the Spring/Summer.  People act like only good things can from from getting Gunz on the field but just as easily it could stunt his development or hurt his confidence.  Stick with BJ and let the best player win during the Spring/Summer/Fall Camp. 

I don't buy this at all, it sounds like an excuse that failures made up to say why they failed. The truly great ones want to be on the field, no matter what. The can get their face kicked in on one play, and they want to get right back out there and kick some ass on the next play. If a guy's got it, he's got it.

I keep going back to this, but... MG's game against Cincy in 2007 is a game where, though he sucked, and we lost, I knew that Matt Grothe had "it". He never quit fighting and put his team back in the game. BJ doesn't have that ability it seems.

I don't know if Gunsby is the guy or not, but, I think he's the best fit that we have. You watch his highlights, and he has some touch, and anticipation with his receivers. He's also athletic enough to do some things with his legs. I am with others... I can tolerate a bad season this year with QB excuses. I can't do it again next year, whether it is BJ, or "he doesn't have any experience". Skip has to do anything and everything possible to fix this situation now. The program can't withstand 3-4 years of 4-win seasons.

If he's that guy he will be  better served to step in after he has a full off season under his belt.  As it stands right now he couldn't beat out a very unimpressive walk on QB for the back up spot.  As I've said all along roll with BJ this season then open it up in the off season.  Either BJ progresses and keeps the spot or one of the young guys, if they are as talented and such better fits for the system as some believe they will win the spot, unless this staff prefers to keep the less talented players on the bench. 

[Orlando Bull]

If Gunsby or one of the incoming early enrollees are a better fit in the system things will work themselves out in the Spring/Summer.  People act like only good things can from from getting Gunz on the field but just as easily it could stunt his development or hurt his confidence.  Stick with BJ and let the best player win during the Spring/Summer/Fall Camp. 

I don't buy this at all, it sounds like an excuse that failures made up to say why they failed. The truly great ones want to be on the field, no matter what. The can get their face kicked in on one play, and they want to get right back out there and kick some *** on the next play. If a guy's got it, he's got it.

I keep going back to this, but... MG's game against Cincy in 2007 is a game where, though he sucked, and we lost, I knew that Matt Grothe had "it". He never quit fighting and put his team back in the game. BJ doesn't have that ability it seems.

I don't know if Gunsby is the guy or not, but, I think he's the best fit that we have. You watch his highlights, and he has some touch, and anticipation with his receivers. He's also athletic enough to do some things with his legs. I am with others... I can tolerate a bad season this year with QB excuses. I can't do it again next year, whether it is BJ, or "he doesn't have any experience". Skip has to do anything and everything possible to fix this situation now. The program can't withstand 3-4 years of 4-win seasons.

If he's that guy he will be  better served to step in after he has a full off season under his belt.  As it stands right now he couldn't beat out a very unimpressive walk on QB for the back up spot.  As I've said all along roll with BJ this season then open it up in the off season.  Either BJ progresses and keeps the spot or one of the young guys, if they are as talented and such better fits for the system as some believe they will win the spot, unless this staff prefers to keep the less talented players on the bench. 

This is a huge assumption. As people who saw them in camp stated, he looked like the number 1. It happens all the time. Brantley red shirted at UF. Was he not better then their back up?  Sam Bradford was a red shirt as well, was it because he couldn't beat out the number 2 guy (Joey Halzie?)? The point is, as others have said, if you have a guy that "should" be your starter and a solid QB, it only makes sense to red shirt the guy with the most potential so that he stays in the system longer.

If you want to compare Leavitt to Holtz, look no further than Carlton Hill...Leavitt let him play as a true freshman because he had a lot of potential, and Julmiste was a huge liability. When your "starter" can't get it done, you have to burn guys like that and hope you can recruit better for the future.

BJ needs to start against Cincy. If BJ continues to play like we've seen this year, Eveld and Ginsby should both get time in the second half, with whoever is better getting the start against RU at home. I don't agree with starting a rookie on the road if you can help it.