Fenelly: "USF Dropping The Ball If It Drops UCF"

[Guest JulmisteForPrez]

These guys at the Trib really need to understand what USF is trying to do in the big picture and not try to impart their shortsighted, small minded wisdom.  If things were as they wish, we'd still be in the Sunbelt conference.

Well, usfgrad84, if those future schedules come out like we think they might, what USF is trying to do is rather puzzling, wouldn't you say?  Ball State??  Buffalo??  Western Kentucky?!?!?!?!?!!!!!

[lotsofbull99]

End the UCF series now!

[bull2saintleo]

I'll be honest, at first I wasn't so hot on this rivalry.  As this topic simmered in my system, I have began to feel that gut feeling that I had for UF (and still do) when FSU played them (before I was a diehard Bull).  USF needs this yearly rivalry, no matter what happens with the Miami series.

[BULLheaded]

Forget the Big Three. It's the Little Two showdown. Their players and fans deserve this. And it could only get bigger.

This quote says it all and EXACTLY why this game is a bad idea. So yippie, we push to get a rivalry and cement in the minds of all the fans, media and recruits around the nation that we are not and will never be at the level of the big three. Shoot, we're not there yet so I guess we should just give up that goal and be happy settling for second best.  :

[bull2saintleo]

Forget the Big Three. It's the Little Two showdown. Their players and fans deserve this. And it could only get bigger.

This quote says it all and EXACTLY why this game is a bad idea. So yippie, we push to get a rivalry and cement in the minds of all the fans, media and recruits around the nation that we are not and will never be at the level of the big three. Shoot, we're not there yet so I guess we should just give up that goal and be happy settling for second best.  :

So playing whipping-boys like Buffalo and Ball State won't further our status?

[Brad]

I think the question is answered in another thread where someone asked what were the ramifications of a loss?

When asked what were the ramifications of a win - no  one responds.  Sort of like playing B-CC in basketball.  How does a win help us?  How (badly) does a loss hurt us?

I think those that understand the downside to the game is far greater than the upside understand part of the issue.  Gee, why won't Miami roll over for us and guarantee us a long term engagement?  They have no reason to do so and good for them.  They're not in the charity business and either are we.

I didn't read the Fennelly column - stopped reading his smug crap years ago.  But I think there are good points on both sides of the argument (he likely has made none of them - only smart ass remarks) everyone should think through and not succumbing to the constant haranguing of UCF types.

Here's an article from another journalist that uses a little less ******** in the formula:

Give UCF-USF 'rivalry' some time to grow

Central Florida? Just another game for South Florida linebacker Stephen Nicholas.

Jacksonville Ed White? Now, that's a rivalry, said Nicholas, who played his high school ball at Jacksonville Lee.

"That has a long tradition," Nicholas said.

UCF and USF? The game has a tradition that is all of 60 minutes. One meeting. Last September. South Florida won 31-14.

The teams meet again Saturday at the Citrus Bowl in Orlando. UCF can't wait.

South Florida?

"I really don't know anything about the War on I-4," Nicholas said. "I just want to win."

This fledgling rivalry between two relatively new Division I-A programs is all one-sided. South Florida has the victory. UCF has the vision.

UCF coach George O'Leary sees it as a natural.

Florida has Florida State. Florida State has Miami. Bethune-Cookman has Florida A&M.

So, UCF must have South Florida.

Even South Florida coach Jim Leavitt admits there are plenty of reasons why the two programs should meet on a yearly basis. It's a short road trip for both schools, so it makes sense financially. The fans seem to want it, so it makes more sense financially.

Leavitt couldn't think of a single downside to a rivalry, which is why, he said, they will continue to meet for the next two seasons.

But Leavitt doesn't see UCF as the ready-made, in-state big game on his schedule. Leavitt wants bigger games. He wants Miami.

O'Leary and Leavitt pick from basically the same talent pool. The Big Three get the really good ones. That leaves USF and UCF vying for the good ones who want to remain in Florida.

Leavitt wants to sell a recruit on games against the Hurricanes in the fabled Orange Bowl, on upsets against Miami at Raymond James Stadium.

He can already sell them on the possibility of playing for a national title since USF plays in the Big East, a BCS conference, while UCF plays in Conference-USA, which is not a member of the BCS. Oh, and USF bolted C-USA for the Big East.

It's a classic example of USF having everything to lose and UCF having everything to gain when the teams meet. On paper, the Bulls are from a stronger conference, so USF should win. How is a loss going to look for the Bulls on the recruiting trail?

Leavitt also mentioned with seven D I-A programs in the state, how can USF decide which to play on a regular basis, and how can it determine that one should be UCF? Well, because O'Leary, who is more of a realist, is right.

The schools are similar in D I-A tradition. They are too close to each other not to play. It will help the winner with recruiting, so that should be incentive enough.

But Nicholas is right in that USF-UCF is not a rivalry.

"Who determines a rivalry?" he asked.

Right now? The fans and the media. After four games, maybe the players and the coaches.

A controversial finish. An upset or two. Maybe a war over one prized recruit. That's usually all it takes for one team to start not liking another and for a game to be more than a game.

Look at the schedules of both schools. Each could use a little spice.

Story Link

[MavTechKNIGHT2]

Here's what I just can't seem to get my arms around.

If we are to play UCF until, and including, the 2008 season, why is

there a sense of urgency to extend the series past that point? By that

I mean, is someone's bonus tied to getting long-term contract signed?

What difference does it make if the decision to play is made in 2008 or

in 2006? I just don't see the merits in deciding this stuff up front.

As an example...did we not have some sort of 4-game deal with BGSU?

And if I recall correctly, that was one-and-done.

Why not wait and see how things shake out in 2006, 2007 and 2008?

Please...someone in the know...explain to me the merits of committing -

either verbally or in writing - to this series. It seems to me that we

would continue to play UCF as part of our BE/CUSA obligations, so again,

it's almost like someone is panicking that this won't get done next year.

IM<HO: I don't see why we don't play this game. It seems like it is one

of the better draws (road trips aside) for the school and I'd much rather

see UCF than FAU/FIU etc.  Then again, this is meant as a hip-pocket deal.

If a better one comes along...

I am in full agreement here, actually.

A few months ago, all we heard was were we going to extend the series after this year.  That finally got done.  Now we want to immediately turn around and work on another extension?  Seems odd for this discussion at this point.

I am in favor of the game IF both schools want to continue it.  It matters not to me if we cancel the series.  I only like it because I can see the game every year.  I know that every other year I am going to at least one road game.

Heck, in 2009 we may be in the same conference or in conferences with bigger stakes....

[Brad]

But by tying in the story of potential future schedules to UCF - it makes it more interesting for some.  

[MavTechKNIGHT2]

Check out the lines on the game.  UCF is favored.  USF is the underdog.  This is the best chance UCF has for a win against USF and if you think the trash talk is bad now wait till after a UCF win.  If anyone is so blind that they cann't see that this game with UCF is a no win situation for the Bulls then go see your optomitrist.

Honestly, I do not want to start a pissing match here, but why in the hell is this UCF's BEST chance to win?

A simple analysis of recruiting classes over the past 2 years does NOT show a dramatic difference between the programs.  Why is USF going to get better and UCF is going to get worse?  And looking at the current verbals, UCF has quite a few players that are highly ranked 2 stars in Rivals and will more than likely have some of those get promoted after their senior year.

Seriously, what is the reasonging behind such logic?

[Triple B]

Well, why does West Virginia play Marshall?

Beacuse they got a probable 5-2 split on home games with the worst being a 4-3. I imagine USF would take that, Marty, you putz.

Why does Tennessee play Memphis?

They've played 6 games in the last 11 years with 4 of those games being @ UT. They only have 2 games scheduled after this year in the next 11 years. Have a freaking clue, Marty.

The more the press and UCF whines about this, the more steadfast I hope the administration stays in not continuing this thing ........ although I shouldn't include ALL the press. Ms Hill over in Orlando is apparently the only one with a clue.